More about Pogorelich

Your 'hot spot' for all classical music subjects. Non-classical music subjects are to be posted in the Corner Pub.

Moderators: Lance, Corlyss_D

Post Reply
Steinway
Posts: 2147
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 10:08 am
Location: Philadelphia
Contact:

More about Pogorelich

Post by Steinway » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:12 am

This is a review that many of us anticapated.

Really disheartening.


http://www.philly.com/inquirer/columnis ... anist.html

maestrob
Posts: 6436
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:30 am

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by maestrob » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:36 am

Cliftwood wrote:This is a review that many of us anticapated.

Really disheartening.


http://www.philly.com/inquirer/columnis ... anist.html
Really sad. :(

If he's unreachable, then there's nothing to be done......

Lance
Site Administrator
Posts: 18165
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:27 am
Location: Binghamton, New York
Contact:

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Lance » Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:03 pm

Well, like Gavrilov, Pogorelich is going off in his own direction. It's a great pity in what happens to some of these pianists whom we remember so well from a few years ago. The Stearns review, I thought, was well done. There was a comment by a reader who didn't think Stearns was "with it" in this review. Frankly, one of the pictures does make Pogorelich look moon-faced, but so what? That doesn't imply that his appearance would have ill-effects on his pianism. Surely, something else did, but not a moon-face or body bulk.
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________

When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]

Image

Chalkperson
Disposable Income Specialist
Posts: 17665
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:19 pm
Location: New York City
Contact:

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Chalkperson » Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:53 pm

Lance wrote:Well, like Gavrilov, Pogorelich is going off in his own direction. It's a great pity in what happens to some of these pianists whom we remember so well from a few years ago. The Stearns review, I thought, was well done. There was a comment by a reader who didn't think Stearns was "with it" in this review. Frankly, one of the pictures does make Pogorelich look moon-faced, but so what? That doesn't imply that his appearance would have ill-effects on his pianism. Surely, something else did, but not a moon-face or body bulk.
Sure it does, the moon face comment is saying that he has let himself go, physically and pianistically, and that he's lost his sense of self discipline...
Sent via Twitter by @chalkperson

Guitarist
Posts: 1160
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2008 10:22 pm
Location: Davis, CA

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Guitarist » Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:09 pm

At he has let his hair grow back! Did anyone read that comment from another audience member? It makes me wonder how much the "critic" exaggerated the performance.

Lance
Site Administrator
Posts: 18165
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:27 am
Location: Binghamton, New York
Contact:

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Lance » Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:18 pm

The photos we saw of Pogorelich—the talented, dashing, Liszt-like, young, handsome, slender Croation—stick in our minds of how we think he might (or should) look today, only because he hasn't made any recordings nor have we seen much advertising of concerts or recitals to watch his physical stature change. I remember those photos of him when he first arrived on the scene. The guy is 51 years old; his metabolism has certainly changed. I don't look like I did 20-25 years ago, either! It's tantamount to saying about Pogorelich what they said about soprano Deborah Voigt: she was "too fat." Those strictures were for "cosmetic/stage" purposes (being seen on the stage, not having that "look" any longer), which didn't affect the quality of her voice no matter how "fat" she was. What has caused Pogorelich to deteriorate (according to many) from days past, isn't caused by his moon-face or body bulk; it's more a matter of interpretation and trying to convey his own, individual ideas on warhorse material that people know well, such a the Chopin piano concertos. Do you see my point?
Chalkperson wrote:
Lance wrote:Well, like Gavrilov, Pogorelich is going off in his own direction. It's a great pity in what happens to some of these pianists whom we remember so well from a few years ago. The Stearns review, I thought, was well done. There was a comment by a reader who didn't think Stearns was "with it" in this review. Frankly, one of the pictures does make Pogorelich look moon-faced, but so what? That doesn't imply that his appearance would have ill-effects on his pianism. Surely, something else did, but not a moon-face or body bulk.
Sure it does, the moon face comment is saying that he has let himself go, physically and pianistically, and that he's lost his sense of self discipline...
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________

When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]

Image

Chalkperson
Disposable Income Specialist
Posts: 17665
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:19 pm
Location: New York City
Contact:

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Chalkperson » Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:38 pm

Lance wrote:What has caused Pogorelich to deteriorate (according to many) from days past, isn't caused by his moon-face or body bulk; it's more a matter of interpretation and trying to convey his own, individual ideas on warhorse material that people know well, such a the Chopin piano concertos. Do you see my point?
Yes, that's why I am talking about self discipline, he's no longer playing the Music the way the Composer wrote it, Weissenberg is another example of this phobia, but, Pogorelich has fallen much, much further...he was always difficult to control, now he's really difficult, even impossible...
Sent via Twitter by @chalkperson

Lance
Site Administrator
Posts: 18165
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:27 am
Location: Binghamton, New York
Contact:

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Lance » Fri Jun 18, 2010 10:58 pm

I checked around the CMG site but didn't find this particular review of a Pogorelich recital in Jerusalem on March 17, published on Friday, June 18, 2010 by The Jerusalem Post. Here's the link. It looks like our boy Pogorelich isn't making friends anywhere. It takes some nerve to tell the audience to "Stop talking," or "this is a concert hall, not your Knesset." I fear Pogorelich has gone the way of Andrei Gavrilov. What a great, great pity. The public is not very forgiving when personalities get in the way as well.

LINK: http://www.jpost.com/LandedPages/PrintA ... ?id=171312
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________

When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]

Image

Lance
Site Administrator
Posts: 18165
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:27 am
Location: Binghamton, New York
Contact:

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Lance » Sat Jun 19, 2010 2:01 pm

After seeing TWO newpapers reviews on Pogorelich and how he is acting/performing with/for his public, what is the opinion of readers? Is Pogorelich way out of line?
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________

When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]

Image

Burbage
Posts: 49
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:38 am

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Burbage » Sat Jun 19, 2010 6:48 pm

Lance wrote:After seeing TWO newpapers reviews on Pogorelich and how he is acting/performing with/for his public, what is the opinion of readers? Is Pogorelich way out of line?
Make that three

I'm sure I'll live to regret this, but I don't see Pogorelich getting many bookings in future.

Chalkperson
Disposable Income Specialist
Posts: 17665
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:19 pm
Location: New York City
Contact:

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Chalkperson » Sat Jun 19, 2010 10:18 pm

Burbage wrote:
Lance wrote:After seeing TWO newpapers reviews on Pogorelich and how he is acting/performing with/for his public, what is the opinion of readers? Is Pogorelich way out of line?
Make that three

I'm sure I'll live to regret this, but I don't see Pogorelich getting many bookings in future.
It's one of the reasons I never go to concerts, every time I listen to Pogo the Clown, I enjoy him... :wink:
Sent via Twitter by @chalkperson

Lance
Site Administrator
Posts: 18165
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:27 am
Location: Binghamton, New York
Contact:

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Lance » Sat Jun 19, 2010 11:26 pm

It's remains a mystery to me how a young artist, who had an opportunity to be at the top, would allow himself—for whatever reason(s)—to destroy his career and reputation by playing in the manner we find today where concert-goers are actually walking out. It has to be some kind of mental problem with the pianist. I know he has gone through some tough times losing his teacher/wife, Aliza Kezeradze, to whom he was married between 1980 and 1996. The concerts stopped, the recordings stopped, and he, apparently, stopped at least for several years. He took an interest in the design of jewelery and did some fund-raising for his country, now Serbia. Here he is, to be 52 years of age in October 2010 and, as someone else remarked, it doesn't seem as though his invitations to perform will be forthcoming in view of what we are seeing at this time.
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________

When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]

Image

Werner
CMG's Elder Statesman
Posts: 4223
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2005 9:23 pm
Location: Irvington, NY

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Werner » Sun Jun 20, 2010 12:01 am

I have never been interested in Pogorelich. There was the brouhaha when Argerich resigned from a competition jury many years ago - I can't remember what competition - because they would not advance Pogo to the next round. And note in the review cited in the beginning post that it was Argerich he was replacing in that Tokyo engagement.

The impression I got then was that this young fellow wasn't sure whether he was an artist or a rock star - anyway, whatever I heard of his on the radio - he recorded Beethoven's Opus 111 and some Chopin that I remember hearing - did not impress me at all.

I've been posting on the Richter thread that I've been reading the Monsaingeon book of notes and comments about Richter. The second half of the volume has many comments by Richter about many musical subjects - including some trenchant - and very generous when merited - judgments of his colleagues. The index shows two comments about Pogorelich - both contemptuous.
Werner Isler

lismahago
Posts: 136
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 12:51 am
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by lismahago » Sat Jun 26, 2010 6:06 pm

Pogorelic' played in Dublin recently: the usual programme, the usual audience reaction. He seems to have been playing the same programme (more or less) for over a year now. Here are some reactions:

Here's what the Jerusalem Post said about Pogorelic’ playing the same programme in March.

And a more positive reaction in Hamburg a year ago.

Same programme at the Edinburgh Festival last August: a blogger is bemused by much of what he hears, but is impressed by Gaspard.

Another reaction to the Edinburgh performance. Again impressed by Gaspard, and prompted to ruminate on what exactly the transaction is between performer and audience in a piano recital. It seems that this was an inspiring experience for some, but that most were not able to travel far enough with Pogorelic’ to take in what he was doing. I suspect it could only work at a live performance and would be less satisfactory for repeated listening on a CD.

Review of the Edinburgh performance in The Scotsman: the reviewer is impressed, but stresses that it was "uncomfortable" to listen to.

GENIUS or wacko? The maverick Croatian pianist Ivo Pogorelich is both. From the Herald, Scotland.

Strasbourg, April 2009, same programme. Again the critic muses on what exactly Pogorelic’ is up to, but is impressed by Gaspard. (In German.) The critic had the impression of hearing hearing works which were at a stage of experimental preparation quite far removed from being ready for public performance. It seems that Pogorelic’ doesn't see it this way as he's performing the same programme a year on and provoking similar reactions! It is interesting that several critics find the performances thought-provoking rather than dismissing them out of hand even though they seem to contain extreme distortions of what one would usually expect.
Ciaran

Cyril Ignatius
Posts: 1035
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 12:14 pm
Location: Pennsylvania

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Cyril Ignatius » Thu Jul 01, 2010 4:07 pm

Lance wrote:After seeing TWO newpapers reviews on Pogorelich and how he is acting/performing with/for his public, what is the opinion of readers? Is Pogorelich way out of line?
Pogorelich is talented, but way out of line. I saw him play the Rachmaninoff 2nd Concerto with the Minnesota Orchestra perhaps 11 years ago, and he had the same issues then, if less extreme. The conductor acknowledged this in a post concert interview. It's unfair to the audiences who have a right to expect sincere efforts to get to the heart of the music and maintain fidelity to the composer. Not recognizing these boundaries only hurts more helpful pianists. It's a triumph of ego over art; of personality over substance. A struggling, but talented pianist could have filled his spot that night or any other night where this pattern plays out.
Cyril Ignatius

Lance
Site Administrator
Posts: 18165
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:27 am
Location: Binghamton, New York
Contact:

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Lance » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:58 pm

As I have mentioned before, I wonder what possesses these artists—who have so much going for them otherwise—to go off on tangents like they have, which then seem to become permanent tangents, losing respect from their critics and public alike. It's happened to at least two pianists whose work I have rather enjoyed: Ivo Pogorelich AND Andrei Gavrilov, the latter of whom I thought would rise to the top and stay there. His Bach recordings (especially the French Suites and concertos on EMI and RCA) continue to ring in my ears. The last live Chopin recital I heard (on CD) was one of the worst and most uninspired performances of Chopin I have ever heard. Are these artists on drugs, having depressive moments, unhappy with life? Gavrilov was well on his way (partly with the help of Sviatoslav Richter) to a great career, recording for EMI and Deutsche Grammophon. Apparently both artists were mere (longer) “flashes in the pan.”
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________

When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]

Image

Cyril Ignatius
Posts: 1035
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 12:14 pm
Location: Pennsylvania

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by Cyril Ignatius » Fri Jul 02, 2010 2:13 pm

I guess when you really think about it, a great deal of the blame must go to those in the professional orchestra management who continue to book these people. All of these great orchestras have the resources to regularly book Thibaudet, Biss, Axe, Bronfman, Gimaud and many more. They know what Pogorelich is inclined to do - so why do they book him? It isn't for the audience. The audience hates classical performers who recompose the music and insert themselves between them and the intention of the composer. Perhaps one or two elite inside core management who are pushing a different agenda?
Cyril Ignatius

gperkins151
Posts: 417
Joined: Sat Feb 11, 2006 6:21 pm
Location: NYC

Re: More about Pogorelich

Post by gperkins151 » Mon Jul 05, 2010 7:24 pm

Cyril Ignatius wrote: I saw him play the Rachmaninoff 2nd Concerto with the Minnesota Orchestra perhaps 11 years ago...
I hear that performance is scheduled to end in a few months.


:wink:
George

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 32 guests