My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
I am wondering which of the following I should get:
Abbado/BPO;
van Immerseel/Anima Eterna;
Hogwood/Academy of Ancient Music or
Zinman/Tonhalle.
Any suggestions?
Abbado/BPO;
van Immerseel/Anima Eterna;
Hogwood/Academy of Ancient Music or
Zinman/Tonhalle.
Any suggestions?
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
The Zinman/Tonhalle set is definitely worth getting, and the way the woodwinds embellish some of their lines is really interesting. Altogether different ! Zinman will be doing a similar HIP influenced Beethoven cycle with the New York Philharmonic next year, toward the end of the season.
But really , I suggest you try cycles by other composers whose symphonies are not quite as famous as Beethoven's.
,too,possibly before you get another Beethoven set.
The set of all seven Ernst Toch symphonies on CPO with Alun Francis and the Berlin R.S.O. is worth a try,
or possibly the three Max Bruch symphonies if you can find the recordings of Masur on Philips and James Conlon on EMI. These are sadly neglected and underrated,in my humble opinion, even though not every one who has heard them likes them. Or symphonies by Alberic Magnard, Albert Roussel, the other four Saint-Saens symphonies besides the familiar "organ" symphony. You can't go wrong with the classic Martinon/EMI set.
Great as Beethoven's symphonies are, there so much more that deserves to be heard !
But really , I suggest you try cycles by other composers whose symphonies are not quite as famous as Beethoven's.
,too,possibly before you get another Beethoven set.
The set of all seven Ernst Toch symphonies on CPO with Alun Francis and the Berlin R.S.O. is worth a try,
or possibly the three Max Bruch symphonies if you can find the recordings of Masur on Philips and James Conlon on EMI. These are sadly neglected and underrated,in my humble opinion, even though not every one who has heard them likes them. Or symphonies by Alberic Magnard, Albert Roussel, the other four Saint-Saens symphonies besides the familiar "organ" symphony. You can't go wrong with the classic Martinon/EMI set.
Great as Beethoven's symphonies are, there so much more that deserves to be heard !
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Seán, if I were in the market for another Beethoven 9 set (and I'm not), of those you mention, I would probably go Abbado/BPO or Zinman/Tonhalle. Both are outstanding, of course, but I would give a slight edge to Abbado. I would love to know which Beethoven 9 sets you already have.
Seán wrote:I am wondering which of the following I should get:
Abbado/BPO;
van Immerseel/Anima Eterna;
Hogwood/Academy of Ancient Music or
Zinman/Tonhalle.
Any suggestions?
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
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When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
There are a lot of options, but not the Hogwood or van Immerseel on period instruments! If you must go with period instruments, try the John Eliot Gardiner on DG Archiv. Personally, and this is just my own preference or prejudice, I would stay far, far away from any period instruments in Beethoven.
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Hi Lance, I have sets by Toscanini, Klemperer, Bernstein, Cluytens (it's marvelous). HvK (1962) (a benchmark), Mackerras (surprisingly good), Blomstedt (vastly underrated), Harnoncourt (a delight), Bruggen (lovely), Gardiner (mixed, worth it for the breathtaking Fifth and Seventh), Solti and Vanska (a consistently good cycle). One can never have too many Beethoven cycles.Lance wrote:Seán, if I were in the market for another Beethoven 9 set (and I'm not), of those you mention, I would probably go Abbado/BPO or Zinman/Tonhalle. Both are outstanding, of course, but I would give a slight edge to Abbado. I would love to know which Beethoven 9 sets you already have.Seán wrote:I am wondering which of the following I should get:
Abbado/BPO;
van Immerseel/Anima Eterna;
Hogwood/Academy of Ancient Music or
Zinman/Tonhalle.
Any suggestions?
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Thanks Robert, I agree with you on Magnard and in particular Roussel, I love their works. I must get the Saint-Saens cycle.THEHORN wrote:... I suggest you try cycles by other composers whose symphonies are not quite as famous as Beethoven's.
,too,possibly before you get another Beethoven set.
The set of all seven Ernst Toch symphonies on CPO with Alun Francis and the Berlin R.S.O. is worth a try,
or possibly the three Max Bruch symphonies if you can find the recordings of Masur on Philips and James Conlon on EMI. These are sadly neglected and underrated,in my humble opinion, even though not every one who has heard them likes them. Or symphonies by Alberic Magnard, Albert Roussel, the other four Saint-Saens symphonies besides the familiar "organ" symphony. You can't go wrong with the classic Martinon/EMI set.
Great as Beethoven's symphonies are, there so much more that deserves to be heard !
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
What sets do you have now?
I would say five complete sets are essential. In chronological order, they are
Furtwangler
Toscanini
Szell
Solti
Gardiner
Any of those you don't have should be priority purchases. I have about 20 sets, and I value others besides the above. Once you have all of these, we can talk of the others.
I would say five complete sets are essential. In chronological order, they are
Furtwangler
Toscanini
Szell
Solti
Gardiner
Any of those you don't have should be priority purchases. I have about 20 sets, and I value others besides the above. Once you have all of these, we can talk of the others.
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Did you ever get Solti/Chicago?Seán wrote:I am wondering which of the following I should get:
Abbado/BPO;
van Immerseel/Anima Eterna;
Hogwood/Academy of Ancient Music or
Zinman/Tonhalle.
Any suggestions?
John
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Rene Leibowitz - if you can find it
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Yes, I did, but I rarely listen to it.CharmNewton wrote:Did you ever get Solti/Chicago?Seán wrote:I am wondering which of the following I should get:
Abbado/BPO;
van Immerseel/Anima Eterna;
Hogwood/Academy of Ancient Music or
Zinman/Tonhalle.
Any suggestions?
John
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Sean, get the Abbado 2001 DG budget priced box set. It is truly one for the ages. Highly recommended, my friend.
Regards,
Mel
Regards,
Mel
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
The Abbado live in Italy and the Zinman are very fine, but I do recommend the Jos van Immerseel, superbly played by any standard and with the best Pastoral in period instruments. You can ask Fergus about this set since he has already heard it.
By the way, a new Chailly recording with the Gewandhaus is coming soon. I already have ordered it because of the marvelous orchestra.
By the way, a new Chailly recording with the Gewandhaus is coming soon. I already have ordered it because of the marvelous orchestra.
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Of those you mention, I have Abbado and Zinman and prefer the latter. I didn't like the sound on the Abbado set (I believe this is the same cycle that is on DVD, where it may sound better). It seems opaque and lacking in orchestral color. Zinman is generally propulsive--quick tempi, sharp accents and outstanding playing. Well-recorded too.CharmNewton wrote:Did you ever get Solti/Chicago?Seán wrote:I am wondering which of the following I should get:
Abbado/BPO;
van Immerseel/Anima Eterna;
Hogwood/Academy of Ancient Music or
Zinman/Tonhalle.
Any suggestions?
John
I just picked up Solti's second Chicago cycle (it's a clearance item from ArkivMusic.com, $30 plus S&H) and really like it. Tempi seem quicker than from the earlier cycle and the low strings are well captured. Only disappointment--I wished the horns were more prominent in the 7th. They should really blow you away, especially the CSO horns. Overall, the new 7th is still better than the older one, though.
John
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
FWIW, what I heard of Hogwood's Beethoven hasn't invited me back for more.Modernistfan wrote:There are a lot of options, but not the Hogwood or van Immerseel on period instruments! If you must go with period instruments, try the John Eliot Gardiner on DG Archiv. Personally, and this is just my own preference or prejudice, I would stay far, far away from any period instruments in Beethoven.
Seán, not long ago I acquired the Harnoncourt Beethoven box, and I love it.
Cheers,
~Karl
Karl Henning, PhD
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston, Massachusetts
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Published by Lux Nova Press
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Composer & Clarinetist
Boston, Massachusetts
http://members.tripod.com/~Karl_P_Henning/
http://henningmusick.blogspot.com/
Published by Lux Nova Press
http://www.luxnova.com/
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Hi, Sean!
I'm a fan of both the Abbado/Berlin (NOT the Vienna) and the Zinman sets. Both are based on similar conducting decisions. I lean towards the Berlin as the obviously better orchestra.
Enjoy!
I'm a fan of both the Abbado/Berlin (NOT the Vienna) and the Zinman sets. Both are based on similar conducting decisions. I lean towards the Berlin as the obviously better orchestra.
Enjoy!
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
I was going to buy his Sibelius cycle.Holden Fourth wrote:Rene Leibowitz - if you can find it
Black lives matter.
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Sean, even though I'd go with Zinman, let me make one unmentioned pick:
KRIPS.
They're solid, mittel-European interpretations. Out of print, but Amazon still has it for (hopefully) reasonable prices.
GO WITH THE (pricier) IMPORT, ON THE EVEREST LABEL. The cheapies were mastered from the atrocious-sounding cassette edition.
KRIPS.
They're solid, mittel-European interpretations. Out of print, but Amazon still has it for (hopefully) reasonable prices.
GO WITH THE (pricier) IMPORT, ON THE EVEREST LABEL. The cheapies were mastered from the atrocious-sounding cassette edition.
Good music is that which falls upon the ear with ease, and quits the memory with difficulty.
--Sir Thomas Beecham
--Sir Thomas Beecham
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
jose, I also preordered the Chailly box set. I think Riccardo will produce a winner, my friend.josé echenique wrote:The Abbado live in Italy and the Zinman are very fine, but I do recommend the Jos van Immerseel, superbly played by any standard and with the best Pastoral in period instruments. You can ask Fergus about this set since he has already heard it.
By the way, a new Chailly recording with the Gewandhaus is coming soon. I already have ordered it because of the marvelous orchestra.
Regards,
Mel
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Sean, I would get Simon Rattle's set with the VPO.
If you have an SACD player, then Haitink's LSO Live set is astounding.
If you have an SACD player, then Haitink's LSO Live set is astounding.
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
I am probably going to be lynched for saying this but I really liked the Rattle cycle. No, I am not a Rattle devotee or anything. I just thought that his Beethoven cycle was excellent. I'd take it over the Solti any day. In fact, I'd rather have my teeth drilled than listen to Solti.
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Whatever that means! Weingartner (a pupil of Hans von Bülow) is a Mitteleuropäer too, yet sounds more like Zinman in many ways.Wallingford wrote: KRIPS.
They're solid, mittel-European interpretations.
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
But you must admit that Solti is quite exciting and the Chicago Symphony plays beautifullly and is well recorded by Decca.Sator wrote:I am probably going to be lynched for saying this but I really liked the Rattle cycle. No, I am not a Rattle devotee or anything. I just thought that his Beethoven cycle was excellent. I'd take it over the Solti any day. In fact, I'd rather have my teeth drilled than listen to Solti.
Regards,
Mel
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
I concur, Seán ... Leibowitz. It used to be on a marvelous stereo LP set issued by Reader's Digest. It came out on CD on, I believe, two labels. One of them I have is a 5-CD set on Scribendum [No. 041]. Chesky Records also issued the same recordings individually and eventually on a Limited Edition gold-boxed set. The Chesky CD set is pricey at around $115, but I found nothing inferior about the Scribendum set when A/B'd to the original stereoLPs. It seems as though I remember a CMG thread on this. Our friend Neil (Wallingford) may be able to give you added info on the Leibowitz recordings and which way to "go" in purchasing them.
diegobueno wrote:I was going to buy his Sibelius cycle.Holden Fourth wrote:Rene Leibowitz - if you can find it
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________
When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
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Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________
When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
"In fact, I'd rather have my teeth drilled than listen to Solti."
I've got a high-speed DIY drill. Shall we fix an appointment for the end of the month?
I've got a high-speed DIY drill. Shall we fix an appointment for the end of the month?
Cheers
Istvan
Istvan
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Of the list provided, I would go for the Zinman cycle. I like the Abbado and Hogwood sets, but the Immerseel didn't appeal based on the excerpts I have heard.
I have long since concluded that the rest of my life will consist of me buying and listening to more and more Beethoven symphony cycles. There will be no end....
Note: I am very excited about the Chailly/Leipzig release
I have long since concluded that the rest of my life will consist of me buying and listening to more and more Beethoven symphony cycles. There will be no end....
Note: I am very excited about the Chailly/Leipzig release
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Funny, I have always felt the same way about Solti, but not quite to the degree you mention. Fortunately my teeth are in excellent shape. I never liked drilling ... but would consider listening to Solti if I had a choice of being drilled! I have always wondered why I haven't been carried away by Solti where others go into ecstasy about his conductorial work. What am I missing?
Istvan wrote:"In fact, I'd rather have my teeth drilled than listen to Solti."
I've got a high-speed DIY drill. Shall we fix an appointment for the end of the month?
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________
When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________
When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
From the original list, I'd lean toward Abbado (I take it that this would be his 3rd cycle (maroon box) rather than the 2nd one (gray box)). I also have Hogwood's and Zinman's sets which I find interesting to hear occasionally but neither of them have pushed aside my favourite sets by Blomstedt, Szell and Wand.Seán wrote:Hi Lance, I have sets by Toscanini, Klemperer, Bernstein, Cluytens (it's marvelous). HvK (1962) (a benchmark), Mackerras (surprisingly good), Blomstedt (vastly underrated), Harnoncourt (a delight), Bruggen (lovely), Gardiner (mixed, worth it for the breathtaking Fifth and Seventh), Solti and Vanska (a consistently good cycle). One can never have too many Beethoven cycles.Lance wrote:Seán, if I were in the market for another Beethoven 9 set (and I'm not), of those you mention, I would probably go Abbado/BPO or Zinman/Tonhalle. Both are outstanding, of course, but I would give a slight edge to Abbado. I would love to know which Beethoven 9 sets you already have.Seán wrote:I am wondering which of the following I should get:
Abbado/BPO;
van Immerseel/Anima Eterna;
Hogwood/Academy of Ancient Music or
Zinman/Tonhalle.
Any suggestions?
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Yes, I am very fond of the Harnoncourt set.karlhenning wrote: FWIW, what I heard of Hogwood's Beethoven hasn't invited me back for more.
Seán, not long ago I acquired the Harnoncourt Beethoven box, and I love it.
Cheers,
~Karl
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Perhaps if you had yours ears drilled instead it might open up your senses to the magic of Georg Solti.....only kidding!Sator wrote:I am probably going to be lynched for saying this but I really liked the Rattle cycle. No, I am not a Rattle devotee or anything. I just thought that his Beethoven cycle was excellent. I'd take it over the Solti any day. In fact, I'd rather have my teeth drilled than listen to Solti.
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Lance, we will have to agree to disagree on Georg Solti, he was a great conductor in my book, he certainly does have his detractors here on CMG, but that don't bother me.Lance wrote:Funny, I have always felt the same way about Solti, but not quite to the degree you mention. Fortunately my teeth are in excellent shape. I never liked drilling ... but would consider listening to Solti if I had a choice of being drilled! I have always wondered why I haven't been carried away by Solti where others go into ecstasy about his conductorial work. What am I missing?Istvan wrote:"In fact, I'd rather have my teeth drilled than listen to Solti."
I've got a high-speed DIY drill. Shall we fix an appointment for the end of the month?
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Now Darrren, that's two thngs you've written that strike a chord with me.bombasticDarren wrote:Of the list provided, I would go for the Zinman cycle. I like the Abbado and Hogwood sets, but the Immerseel didn't appeal based on the excerpts I have heard.
I have long since concluded that the rest of my life will consist of me buying and listening to more and more Beethoven symphony cycles. There will be no end....
Note: I am very excited about the Chailly/Leipzig release
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Seán wrote:Lance, we will have to agree to disagree on Georg Solti, he was a great conductor in my book, he certainly does have his detractors here on CMG, but that don't bother me.Lance wrote:Funny, I have always felt the same way about Solti, but not quite to the degree you mention. Fortunately my teeth are in excellent shape. I never liked drilling ... but would consider listening to Solti if I had a choice of being drilled! I have always wondered why I haven't been carried away by Solti where others go into ecstasy about his conductorial work. What am I missing?Istvan wrote:"In fact, I'd rather have my teeth drilled than listen to Solti."
I've got a high-speed DIY drill. Shall we fix an appointment for the end of the month?
Sean, count me as a Solti admirer, too, my friend.
Regards,
Mel
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
The current edition from Madacy Entertainment (in the tin box) was mastered from the three-track originals. See the review on Amazon.com, where the reviewer publishes an e-mail he received from the re-mastering engineer. These sound pretty good, much better than the Bescol edition from the late 1980s, but have reversed channels. The engineer mentions that he went back and re-mastered them to sound even better, but it isn't known if Madacy ever issued the re-mastered recordings.Wallingford wrote:Sean, even though I'd go with Zinman, let me make one unmentioned pick:
KRIPS.
They're solid, mittel-European interpretations. Out of print, but Amazon still has it for (hopefully) reasonable prices.
GO WITH THE (pricier) IMPORT, ON THE EVEREST LABEL. The cheapies were mastered from the atrocious-sounding cassette edition.
John
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
If you already have and like Harnoncourt, I would't go for Zinman. In fact, except maybe for No. 9, I feel that Harnoncourt's better and more inspired than Zinman in the category HIP-influenced with a 'modern' band.Seán wrote:Yes, I am very fond of the Harnoncourt set.karlhenning wrote: FWIW, what I heard of Hogwood's Beethoven hasn't invited me back for more.
Seán, not long ago I acquired the Harnoncourt Beethoven box, and I love it.
Cheers,
~Karl
For HIP on period instruments, Van Immerseel's a very good choice IMO: thoughtful and vivid playing without overpowering. I consider his integral the best PI set, together with Brüggen's recordings for Philips.
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
I have the tin box and can confirm that these did not come from LP recordings.CharmNewton wrote:The current edition from Madacy Entertainment (in the tin box) was mastered from the three-track originals. See the review on Amazon.com, where the reviewer publishes an e-mail he received from the re-mastering engineer. These sound pretty good, much better than the Bescol edition from the late 1980s, but have reversed channels. The engineer mentions that he went back and re-mastered them to sound even better, but it isn't known if Madacy ever issued the re-mastered recordings.Wallingford wrote:Sean, even though I'd go with Zinman, let me make one unmentioned pick:
KRIPS.
They're solid, mittel-European interpretations. Out of print, but Amazon still has it for (hopefully) reasonable prices.
GO WITH THE (pricier) IMPORT, ON THE EVEREST LABEL. The cheapies were mastered from the atrocious-sounding cassette edition.
John
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Yes agreed. Compared to Harnoncourt - maybe except as to the Pastoral - Zinman seems almost superfluous. I would consider Mackerras a strong contender (preferably the Liverpool recording).Marc wrote: If you already have and like Harnoncourt, I would't go for Zinman. In fact, except maybe for No. 9, I feel that Harnoncourt's better and more inspired than Zinman in the category HIP-influenced with a 'modern' band.
Yes, I agree that these two sets are excellent, but have you heard the Hanover band / Roy Goodman or the new set with Krivine, and if so - what do you think of them?Marc wrote: For HIP on period instruments, Van Immerseel's a very good choice IMO: thoughtful and vivid playing without overpowering. I consider his integral the best PI set, together with Brüggen's recordings for Philips.
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Sean:
In response to Lance's suggestion about the Leibowitz set, it's impossible to go wrong with it interpretation-wise. I believe I heard one disc of the Chesky remasterings (I had the Reader's Digest vinyl set these last two decades), and the sound is at least up to par on the CD.
I see on Amazon's UK site that the five single discs are the only way to go.
In response to Lance's suggestion about the Leibowitz set, it's impossible to go wrong with it interpretation-wise. I believe I heard one disc of the Chesky remasterings (I had the Reader's Digest vinyl set these last two decades), and the sound is at least up to par on the CD.
I see on Amazon's UK site that the five single discs are the only way to go.
Good music is that which falls upon the ear with ease, and quits the memory with difficulty.
--Sir Thomas Beecham
--Sir Thomas Beecham
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
I find many of the performances in that set exciting and stirring, even frantic. But I also like the magisterial type of Beethoven from the likes of Klemperer.Sator wrote:I am probably going to be lynched for saying this but I really liked the Rattle cycle. No, I am not a Rattle devotee or anything. I just thought that his Beethoven cycle was excellent. I'd take it over the Solti any day. In fact, I'd rather have my teeth drilled than listen to Solti.
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Nope. I realize I should have written: of the PI sets that I know ....premont wrote:Yes, I agree that these two sets are excellent, but have you heard the Hanover band / Roy Goodman or the new set with Krivine, and if so - what do you think of them?Marc wrote: For HIP on period instruments, Van Immerseel's a very good choice IMO: thoughtful and vivid playing without overpowering. I consider his integral the best PI set, together with Brüggen's recordings for Philips.
Honestly, I'm not a Beethoven Beast, but I will take your advices about Mackerras, Goodman et al in consideration, without promising anything of course.
Other sets that I own and like very very much are the earlier mentioned golden oldie Leibowitz (sublime!), and the newer 'oldie' Haitink (his 3rd Beet symphs integral, with the LSO).
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
'conductor René Leibowitz went so far as to describe Sibelius as "the worst composer in the world" 'diegobueno wrote:I was going to buy his Sibelius cycle.Holden Fourth wrote:Rene Leibowitz - if you can find it
heheh...please inform as to when it is released to the public!
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Thanks Neil, they are available on Amazon uk as single cds.Wallingford wrote:Sean:
In response to Lance's suggestion about the Leibowitz set, it's impossible to go wrong with it interpretation-wise. I believe I heard one disc of the Chesky remasterings (I had the Reader's Digest vinyl set these last two decades), and the sound is at least up to par on the CD.
I see on Amazon's UK site that the five single discs are the only way to go.
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
So much more surprising you are that well versed in recordings of his symphonies.Marc wrote: Honestly, I'm not a Beethoven Beast
Yes, Leibowitz, Other fine sets are the often overlooked Kletzki and Maag.Marc wrote: Other sets that I own and like very very much are the earlier mentioned golden oldie Leibowitz (sublime!), and the newer 'oldie' Haitink (his 3rd Beet symphs integral, with the LSO).
Haitink (3) is on my wish-list.
Krivine is still in my to-be-listened-to pile.
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
That's a nice thing to say .... yet not true.premont wrote:So much more surprising you are that well versed in recordings of his symphonies.Marc wrote: Honestly, I'm not a Beethoven Beast
Complete sets I know are: Konwitschny/Gewandhaus Leipzig (only on music cassette, my dad has the vinyl box), Kegel/Dresden (only on vinyl), Leibowitz, Blomstedt, Sawallisch, Norrington (first one, PI), Zinman, Haitink 3 and Van Immerseel.
Also some stuff from the integrals by Brüggen (again, only on cassette, but my memories are very positive) and Harnoncourt.
And a cherished 5 & 7 combi disc with Carlos Kleiber. And a 9th with Haitink/Concertgebouw/Popp et al. And another 9th with Herreweghe. And various discs with Von Karajan (most of them part of the DG Galleria series -> 2nd DG cycle of the 70s). And a mono Karajan/Philharmonia playing the 5th. And a DVD with Eduard van Beinum conducting the 3rd.
And probably some other stuff I forgot to mention.
Not an impressive list at all, compared to the amount of (in)complete recordings of Beet's symphonic output. I mean, there must be hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of them, if not more. And I do not inted to hunt after them; my bow is pointed at other musical treats.
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Nice list BTW, except that I never have warmed to Karajan´s Beethoven.Marc wrote: Complete sets I know are: Konwitschny/Gewandhaus Leipzig (only on music cassette, my dad has the vinyl box), Kegel/Dresden (only on vinyl), Leibowitz, Blomstedt, Sawallisch, Norrington (first one, PI), Zinman, Haitink 3 and Van Immerseel.
Also some stuff from the integrals by Brüggen (again, only on cassette, but my memories are very positive) and Harnoncourt.
And a cherished 5 & 7 combi disc with Carlos Kleiber. And a 9th with Haitink/Concertgebouw/Popp et al. And another 9th with Herreweghe. And various discs with Von Karajan (most of them part of the DG Galleria series -> 2nd DG cycle of the 70s). And a mono Karajan/Philharmonia playing the 5th. And a DVD with Eduard van Beinum conducting the 3rd.
So is my bow, but I have kept my passion for Beethoven, which I inherited from my father.Marc wrote: my bow is pointed at other musical treats.
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
The mono recording with the Philharmonia is very good IMO.premont wrote:Nice list BTW, except that I never have warmed to Karajan´s Beethoven.Marc wrote: Complete sets I know are: [....]
The Beatles arrive in the US of A for the first time.premont wrote:So is my bow, but I have kept my passion for Beethoven, which I inherited from my father.Marc wrote: my bow is pointed at other musical treats.
Press conference at JFK Airport on February 7th 1964.
Q: What do you think of Beethoven?
Ringo Starr: Great. Especially his poems.
This time for real:
Beethoven is great. Period.
But I have almost his entire output on disc, and in his case I switched from purchasing to just listening.
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
That's odd: Klemperer has only been mentioned once. Has anyone heard the live version made in Vienna with the Philharmonia in the 1960s? If I were to consider a set, this would come very high but I know nothing of the sound.
I have what some would consider an eccentric choice of Beethoven symphonies:
Full cycles: Mengelberg; Katsaris (piano).
"Eroica": Solti with VPO and LSO (the latter on BBC Legends is a winner in my view).
4th, 5th and 6th: Celibidache
7th: Solti with VPO
9th: Solti (1st CSO version); Karajan, 1972, considered a classic but too smooth and without surprises (in my arrogant opinion).
I have what some would consider an eccentric choice of Beethoven symphonies:
Full cycles: Mengelberg; Katsaris (piano).
"Eroica": Solti with VPO and LSO (the latter on BBC Legends is a winner in my view).
4th, 5th and 6th: Celibidache
7th: Solti with VPO
9th: Solti (1st CSO version); Karajan, 1972, considered a classic but too smooth and without surprises (in my arrogant opinion).
Cheers
Istvan
Istvan
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Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Agreed. I am extremely partial to Rattle's Beethoven efforts so farSator wrote:I am probably going to be lynched for saying this but I really liked the Rattle cycle. No, I am not a Rattle devotee or anything. I just thought that his Beethoven cycle was excellent
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
Sorry lads, I have ordered the Abbado set.bombasticDarren wrote:Agreed. I am extremely partial to Rattle's Beethoven efforts so farSator wrote:I am probably going to be lynched for saying this but I really liked the Rattle cycle. No, I am not a Rattle devotee or anything. I just thought that his Beethoven cycle was excellent
Seán
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
"To appreciate the greatness of the Masters is to keep faith in the greatness of humanity." - Wilhelm Furtwängler
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
I also have that van Beinum DVD. I believe this was a television program on the 10th anniversary of VE-day? Whatever, it was some important occasion. Fascinating to watch, even just from the standpoint of how the orchestra and audience are dressed.Marc wrote:That's a nice thing to say .... yet not true.premont wrote:So much more surprising you are that well versed in recordings of his symphonies.Marc wrote: Honestly, I'm not a Beethoven Beast
Complete sets I know are: Konwitschny/Gewandhaus Leipzig (only on music cassette, my dad has the vinyl box), Kegel/Dresden (only on vinyl), Leibowitz, Blomstedt, Sawallisch, Norrington (first one, PI), Zinman, Haitink 3 and Van Immerseel.
Also some stuff from the integrals by Brüggen (again, only on cassette, but my memories are very positive) and Harnoncourt.
And a cherished 5 & 7 combi disc with Carlos Kleiber. And a 9th with Haitink/Concertgebouw/Popp et al. And another 9th with Herreweghe. And various discs with Von Karajan (most of them part of the DG Galleria series -> 2nd DG cycle of the 70s). And a mono Karajan/Philharmonia playing the 5th. And a DVD with Eduard van Beinum conducting the 3rd.
And probably some other stuff I forgot to mention.
Not an impressive list at all, compared to the amount of (in)complete recordings of Beet's symphonic output. I mean, there must be hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of them, if not more. And I do not inted to hunt after them; my bow is pointed at other musical treats.
Re: My next Bethoven Symphony cycle should be?
This is the set I have, and I believe they were recorded in the 1950s. Great set, but the 9th is excruciatingly bad. The concertoes with Barenboim are among the best I've heard.Istvan wrote:That's odd: Klemperer has only been mentioned once. Has anyone heard the live version made in Vienna with the Philharmonia in the 1960s? If I were to consider a set, this would come very high but I know nothing of the sound.
I have what some would consider an eccentric choice of Beethoven symphonies:
Full cycles: Mengelberg; Katsaris (piano).
"Eroica": Solti with VPO and LSO (the latter on BBC Legends is a winner in my view).
4th, 5th and 6th: Celibidache
7th: Solti with VPO
9th: Solti (1st CSO version); Karajan, 1972, considered a classic but too smooth and without surprises (in my arrogant opinion).
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