Classical on vinyl

Your 'hot spot' for all classical music subjects. Non-classical music subjects are to be posted in the Corner Pub.

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slofstra
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Classical on vinyl

Post by slofstra » Sat Mar 28, 2015 8:34 am

Classical on vinyl.

Is there a market for it? Who is selling it? Who is buying it? Who is listening to it?

Or is it all headed for the dumpster?

John F
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by John F » Sat Mar 28, 2015 10:53 am

When NYPL had a sell-off of mainly classical LPs a couple of years ago, thousands of them, they sold out in a day or two. But they were priced to sell, at $1 a disc. For the kind of prices that would appeal to you, I doubt it. Otherwise there would be more record stores selling them. Nowadays there are hardly any bricks-and-mortar stores at all, and if there's an important seller of old/used LPs online, I don't know what it is.
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slofstra
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by slofstra » Sat Mar 28, 2015 11:36 am

John, I don't have any to sell actually. Well I do have a few, but I don't plan to sell them any time soon.

There is some kind of market.

For example, here is someone selling vinyl from Sweden on eBay. There are many items sitting at $9.99 with no bids. But a number of items do have bids, including a Bernstein/ RCO Mahler 1st symphony with a top bid of $58.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_nkw=&_a ... ot4&_sop=1

I notice that he takes care to describe condition, and also the way he packs for shipping. Shipping costs run $35 per record for Canada.
Last edited by slofstra on Sat Mar 28, 2015 11:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

slofstra
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by slofstra » Sat Mar 28, 2015 11:40 am

My working assumption is that, while there is no general market for classical vinyl, there is, or may be emerging, a specialised collectors' market.

Here is a picture from a used vinyl store in Toronto.

Image

John F
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by John F » Sat Mar 28, 2015 12:01 pm

slofstra wrote:John, I don't have any to sell actually. Well I do have a few, but I don't plan to sell them any time soon.

There is some kind of market.

For example, here is someone selling vinyl from Sweden on eBay. There are many items sitting at $9.99 with no bids. But a number of items do have bids, including a Bernstein/ RCO Mahler 1st symphony with a top bid of $58.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_nkw=&_a ... ot4&_sop=1

I notice that he takes care to describe condition, and also the way he packs for shipping. Shipping costs run $35 per record for Canada.
I know that people sell LPs on eBay a disc at a time, I mentioned a couple of them myself in another thread. They sell 78s too. But that's hardly a significant market; it's the equivalent of a garage sale. And it's no use at all to collectors like Lance and me with many hundreds and even thousands of LPs to dispose of.

When it was time to dispose of my father's library, we were able to get several dealers to come to his house, assess what he had, and make an offer. Books aren't becoming technologically obsolete. Back in the 1970s there were such dealers in used records; Joseph Greenspan of Discophile in Greenwich Village opened a store called Ludus Tonalis and bought whole collections to stock it. But today the only store in NYC that has a significant stock of classical LPs, Academy Records, requires would-be sellers to bring their wares to the store. Even if I could bring my 120 shelf feet of LPs there, they wouldn't let me, and the space they devote to their LP stock would be inadequate for it.

If you want to continue with this topic nonetheless, go right ahead, but I'm afraid it's pointless.
John Francis

Heck148
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by Heck148 » Sat Mar 28, 2015 1:37 pm

John F wrote:Nowadays there are hardly any bricks-and-mortar stores at all, and if there's an important seller of old/used LPs online, I don't know what it is.
Looney Tunes in Boston had a big collection of vinyl LPs for sale...but I've no idea if their brick/mortar stores even exist any more...

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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by John F » Sat Mar 28, 2015 4:56 pm

That's what Joe Greenspan called his Ludus Tonalis store: looney tunes.
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piston
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by piston » Sat Mar 28, 2015 6:51 pm

The technology is 67 years old in the US (Columbia ML 4001) and 66 in France (Oiseau-Lyre). Time to let go! I keep mine as artefacts more than anything else. Someone in Jersey tried to sell one of the Oiseau-Lyre record in question for 999 dollars about a month ago. Perhaps, you've got something valuable in your old collection, not for the music but for technological or discographic reasons.
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by Lance » Sat Mar 28, 2015 11:39 pm

I've been to Academy Records many times in years gone by. I talked to them about my collection and the number involved. They merely said that they were "not buying presently," but were hoping to reduce their current stock until they buy considerably more.

I did buy a 10-inch RCA LP a couple of months ago ... first one in probably two years. Before that, I bought up a few LPs that have never been transferred to CD of the fabulous bass singer OWEN BRANNIGAN ... and have not regretted buying just these few LPs though they were a bit on pricey side.

I still want to sell my entire LP collection ... and contrary to what I thought and what John Francis has said, I may have to let the collection be cherry-picked. The remainder, I'm not sure - yet. Naturally, I would probably keep about 5% of it, maybe 10%. But there is still and will always be a storage problem.
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slofstra
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by slofstra » Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:33 am

I was hoping the thread wouldn't be just opinions on the state of the classical vinyl market, but that we could put our heads together and come up with some actual information on the subject.
And there has been some of that.
There definitely is an emerging small market for rock classics and for jazz on new vinyl. Classical?

There's a couple of interesting comments in the following article from August 2014.

"New vinyl represents just 0.4 percent of unit sales of physical classical music. While that figure is up from 0.1 percent a year earlier, it is still small compared to other genres, such as rock music or dance and electronic music. "

An interesting comment from Jerry Webber, owner of Jerry's Records, "There are a few bright spots. Dealers from Japan, Taiwan, Hong Kong and China come into the store and purchase hundreds of classical records at a time. 'Those guys keep me going,' he said. Some heavy hitters – the Beethovens, the George Gershwins, the Glenn Goulds, the Yo-Yo Mas – are popular within the section. And an aisle in the main room features 20th-century classical and electronic music, with composers such as John Cage and Steve Reich drawing customers interested in cutting-edge music regardless of genre."

http://www.post-gazette.com/ae/music/20 ... 1408030013

slofstra
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by slofstra » Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:35 am

Well, Lance, maybe a trip to Tokyo would be in order. :)

http://www.vinylrecordcollector.net/201 ... table.html

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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by slofstra » Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:48 am

Here is a UK business and web site that is selling £50 million of vinyl a year. The following list provides an indication of the kinds of records in the classical realm that command higher prices. Not surprisingly rarity is an important factor.

http://991.com/Buy/PresetList.aspx?pageID=865

John F
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by John F » Sun Mar 29, 2015 9:30 am

Interesting. There's not much classical music on their home page, especially toward the top, and at first glance, the prices for those are mostly comparable with what the CDs cost. They must be selling a whole lot of LPs - and CDs, they sell those too - if their annual gross is £50 million ($74 million) a year. And it seems they make most of their money from pop and rock.

No use to us - they say they only buy from the UK and France, and besides, shipping LPs to them would eat up much or all of what they might pay us.
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by jserraglio » Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:25 am

https://www.mikrokosmos.com/index.asp

Canada. Mail order. Deep stock. But cheap they ain't. Merged a while back with Ars Antiqua.

John F
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by John F » Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:56 am

Interesting. Most of the prices look pretty cheap to me, and since they probably pay no more than 1/4 of their resale price and possibly less (that's what Joe Greenspan did), you'd have to sell them a lot of LPs to make any money. Of course, a lot of LPs is what we have... And I don't see anywhere on the site anything about how and even if they buy, though they must at least occasionally.
John Francis

jserraglio
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by jserraglio » Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:07 am

John F wrote:Interesting. Most of the prices look pretty cheap to me, and since they probably pay no more than 1/4 of their resale price and possibly less (that's what Joe Greenspan did), you'd have to sell them a lot of LPs to make any money. Of course, a lot of LPs is what we have... And I don't see anywhere on the site anything about how and even if they buy, though they must at least occasionally.
Hidden charges. They zap you on shipping. 14 dollars for first LP. $1.80 thereafter. Pretty steep in my view. Wouldn't surprise me if Canfield is one of their buyers since they merged with his company. The items he bought from my friend were mostly headed to the market. I think the top price he paid was about $6.00.

slofstra
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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by slofstra » Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:30 am

John F wrote:Interesting. There's not much classical music on their home page, especially toward the top, and at first glance, the prices for those are mostly comparable with what the CDs cost. They must be selling a whole lot of LPs - and CDs, they sell those too - if their annual gross is £50 million ($74 million) a year. And it seems they make most of their money from pop and rock.

No use to us - they say they only buy from the UK and France, and besides, shipping LPs to them would eat up much or all of what they might pay us.
"We will travel worldwide for large and valuable collections." However, the caveat is that this seems to apply to pop and rock collections.

http://991.com/Sell/index.aspx

.4% of all new classical music sold (as of August 2014) is in vinyl format. It's a sliver of an already small market. However, there are people listening to classical vinyl, and it appears to be a growing market. It's only natural that some of the allure of vinyl will spill over into the classical market.

I'm approaching this subject more out of general curiousity and I'm personally not that interested in the potential of liquidating a large or small collection of vinyl.

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Re: Classical on vinyl

Post by slofstra » Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:35 am

jserraglio wrote:https://www.mikrokosmos.com/index.asp

Canada. Mail order. Deep stock. But cheap they ain't. Merged a while back with Ars Antiqua.
Interesting. It's a Mom and Pop operation in Toronto.

Use this page to see what they have on offer.

https://www.mikrokosmos.com/download_lists.asp

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