"Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

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Rach3
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"Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by Rach3 » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:21 am

“Classical Music for a Modern Age “ , a series of brief videos by Classical music critic Ivan Hewitt of the UK’s The Telegraph.

First I watched :

“ Ludovico Einaudi on bringing the spirit of Jimi Hendrix to classical music “ , a 5 minute video interview with the artist and accompanying brief written narrative. The most streamed “ classical “ musician in the World, per the Telegraph.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/music/class ... o-einaudi/

I had not heard of this composer ; for reasons I now better understand.

Followed without pause by a 7 minute “ classical club night “ video with Hewitt and Gabriel Prokofieff.

There are then other videos following without pause or need for a new link .

“We dont need patriarchy, what we need is inclusivity “, says one “ alternative performance “ artist in the next video. In other words, “ dumbing down “ ?

Or necessary “ baby steps “ that will lead to greater appreciation of the standard CM repertoire and thus “ save “ CM “? Not my assessment of a savior after these videos. Not quite the same mental or emotional effort required as evolving an appreciation for some of the Second Viennese School or Minimalism or Ives. Perhaps I am too parochial ?

jbuck919
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by jbuck919 » Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:54 pm

Very recently on NPR I heard excerpts from a jazz composer (yes, there are such, it seems) whose work was about to appear locally. I regret not having gotten the name. It was very definitely jazz (for a small ensemble) but modernist jazz. I already knew that such existed, and while I can't imagine myself warming up to it, I also didn't exactly hate it (the way I feel about much jazz in general) and heard more validity in it than in the stuff Rach3 presents with apparent disapproval.

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

Rach3
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by Rach3 » Thu Jun 07, 2018 6:41 pm

jbuck919 wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:54 pm
I already knew that such existed, and while I can't imagine myself warming up to it, I also didn't exactly hate it (the way I feel about much jazz in general) and heard more validity in it than in the stuff Rach3 presents with apparent disapproval.
Quite understand. There is good stuff, just did not hear much such stuff on the BBC videos.For example , 2 cd's I have:

http://tinyurl.com/y9thn46r ( George Antheil's PC # 2 and "Jazz Sonata " )

http://tinyurl.com/y9bqqp99 ( Works of the Kevin Oldham )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPAcPok5DVY ( Bill Evans' " Peace Piece " )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgX7h2-TvKY ( Bill Evans Trio,"Autumn Leaves " )

John F
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by John F » Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:09 am

jbuck919 wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:54 pm
Very recently on NPR I heard excerpts from a jazz composer (yes, there are such, it seems) whose work was about to appear locally. I regret not having gotten the name. It was very definitely jazz (for a small ensemble) but modernist jazz. I already knew that such existed, and while I can't imagine myself warming up to it, I also didn't exactly hate it (the way I feel about much jazz in general) and heard more validity in it than in the stuff Rach3 presents with apparent disapproval.
Quite a few jazz composers, actually, from Duke Ellington to the Modern Jazz Quartet to Wynton Marsalis and beyond. Example in ABACADA form, essentially a rondo, the A sections composed, the others improvised:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGBWMbIgYj8

The composer is the MJQ's pianist John Lewis.

The thing is, jazz today has a much smaller audience than classical music, especially the most modern of modern jazz - John Coltrane, Ornette Coleman, etc. And classical composers have long since absorbed the rhythms and chords of jazz in their own ways:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jYVnNHo3S8

For that matter, Mozart included popular dance tunes and songs of his day in the finales of a couple of his violin concertos. He and his father referred to the G major as the Strassburger because the finale includes the song "Zu Strassburg auf der Schanz."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL1dprfbWf8

So there's no practical or historical reason not to bring the spirit of Jimi Hendrix to classical music, if it can be done without merely creating a Hendrix pastiche. I don't know that I'd like it, but there's a lot of music that I don't particularly like, including some classical.
John Francis

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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by jserraglio » Fri Jun 08, 2018 5:57 am

Andre Previn is a jazz composer of some note. And assuming that composition may allow for some improvisation: Thelonious Monk, Charles Mingus, Dave Brubeck, Thomas 'Fats' Waller, Quincy Jones, John Zorn, Willie 'the Lion' Smith, Fletcher Henderson, Mel Tormé, Dick Hyman, Louis & Lil Armstrong, Sun Ra, Miles Davis, etc. etc.

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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by John F » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:09 am

Brubeck, certainly. For me, there's a difference between making original music and actually writing it down, the difference between improvisation which is ephemeral and varies from day to day and composition which is lasting and repeatable by others. I like Monk's music, some of it, but I'm not aware that he ever wrote down a note of it. Maybe he did?
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jserraglio
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by jserraglio » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:41 am

John F wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:09 am
Brubeck,certainly, for me ... I like Monk's music, some of it, but I'm not aware that he ever wrote down a note of it. Maybe he did?
Time Out by Brubeck was my intro to jazz! If Monk did write down his music, I'd sure like to know about it. But I saw Ellington live in concert once and thought his original improvisations were just as involving as hearing Cliburn interpret what Debussy wrote down. A masterful musician. Privileged to have heard him in person.
Monk's biographer, Robin D.G. Kelley wrote:About those wrong notes: Monk's radical idea was not to add more notes to chords but rather take them away, creating much more dissonance. He'd often play two-note chords—for instance taking the third and the fifth out of a major seventh chord and playing just the root and major seventh—and wham, there's Monk's sound. It's the right chord, yet he makes it sound like a completely bizarre choice.

Rach3
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by Rach3 » Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:12 pm

Boris Blacher’s very brief, very " jazzy" Piano Sonata , Op. 39 ( 1951 ) :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx6b51_FhfU

jserraglio
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by jserraglio » Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:57 pm


diegobueno
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by diegobueno » Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:04 pm

Classical composition involves an approach to structure and continuity which popular styles of music generally lack. Classical composition is not defined by style but rather by an approach to structure. Therefore, provided that approach to structure is present, there is no reason not to incorporate stylistic elements from whatever popular music happens to be in the composer's head. This is not "dumbing down", but compositional honesty.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rq5wRE2QaXQ

jserraglio
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by jserraglio » Sat Jun 09, 2018 11:05 am


John F
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by John F » Sat Jun 09, 2018 11:42 am

diegobueno wrote:Classical composition involves an approach to structure and continuity which popular styles of music generally lack. Classical composition is not defined by style but rather by an approach to structure.
It ain't necessarily so, though often it is. jserraglio has provided an instance of a jazz composition which is structurally indistinguishable from classical music. (Cool!) And there are quite a few Schubert songs which are structurally indistinguishable from a show tune by Cole Porter or Richard Rodgers. Jazz has certain distinctive rhythms and chords that weren't used in classical music until jazz came along. '50s rock and present-day rap have distinctive patterns in their accompaniments but I've never heard either in any classical music.

Classical composers have written music that isn't exactly popular - that is, recordings of it don't sell in the millions - but use the forms and rhythms of pop music. Cf. William Bolcom's rags for piano. And some classical composers have actually succeeded in writing popular music, cf. Leonard Bernstein in "West Side Story." But I don't believe that fans of "West Side Story" have been flocking to concerts featuring Bernstein's Mass or the Jeremiah Symphony, or would enjoy it if they did. Again, if new listeners are to be won for classical music, it's classical music that will have to do it.
Last edited by John F on Sat Jun 09, 2018 11:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
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diegobueno
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by diegobueno » Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:32 am

John F. I'm not quite sure what your message has to do with what I wrote, whether that was supposed to be a rebuttal or what.

Certainly classical music will only survive if people keep writing it. And if they choose to write it incorporating stylistic elements of popular music, that will be fine and legitimate. Because classical music, as I said before, is not a style, it is an approach to musical structure. Just because you have not heard the distinctive patterns of rock or rap in any classical music doesn't preclude the possibility of such classical music existing.

https://soundcloud.com/markgsimon/chamb ... ii-ah-need

diegobueno
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Re: "Classical Music for a Modern Age" videos

Post by diegobueno » Sun Jun 10, 2018 7:02 am

I'll have to say, though, that I don't find a lot to recommend in the examples I've heard of Ludovico Einaudi.

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