Dvorak Symphony 5

Your 'hot spot' for all classical music subjects. Non-classical music subjects are to be posted in the Corner Pub.

Moderators: Lance, Corlyss_D

Post Reply
Rach3
Posts: 408
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:17 am

Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by Rach3 » Mon Aug 27, 2018 3:08 pm

To supplement earlier recent threads here about Symphonies 7,8,9 , and 6,7, here is a recording of 5, one of my favs of the set ( the others for me being 7,9 ) :

Vaclav Neumann, Czech Phil:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4Jhky9zTH0

Slow mov. a bit too long, unfocused to my ear, but a work that should be heard more often I think.

“ In October 1887 Dvorak dedicated his symphony to celebrated German conductor Hans von Bulow, who had already been a great promoter of the composer’s works abroad during the 1870s. Bulow responded to the dedication in a letter dated 25. 11. 1887 : ‘ Esteemed Maestro! The dedication from you – alongside Brahms the most blessed composer of our times – is a higher honour for me than any grand cross from any prince. With the most heartfelt thanks I accept this honour. Your sincerely devoted admirer, Hans von Bulow.’ “ http://www.antonin-dvorak.cz/en/symphony5

THEHORN
Posts: 2557
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2008 8:57 am

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by THEHORN » Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:27 pm

This is a wonderful symphony , but sadly neglected because most conductors never bother to program any of the Dvorak symphonies beyond the last three . A pity . Audiences would love it if they got a chance to hear it live .
And too many concertgoers don't want to hear anything other than their beloved warhorses of the repertoire and shy away from concerts featuring unfamiliar repertoire . Paeticularly the older audience members .

Rach3
Posts: 408
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:17 am

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by Rach3 » Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:59 pm

THEHORN wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:27 pm
And too many concertgoers don't want to hear anything other than their beloved warhorses of the repertoire and shy away from concerts featuring unfamiliar repertoire . Paeticularly the older audience members .
And most of the older are retired, with plenty of time to hear , explore, learn new repertoire , especially cheaply now on-line, yet pay a fortune for live concert tickets to hear "New World " umpteenth time.

Belle
Posts: 1255
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:45 am

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by Belle » Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:37 pm

What do you think of the Dvorak Piano Concerto which Kleiber recorded with Richter?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3djC4LV_WA

Kleiber absolutely loved Richter and vice versa.

Rach3
Posts: 408
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:17 am

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by Rach3 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:44 am

Belle wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:37 pm
What do you think of the Dvorak Piano Concerto which Kleiber recorded with Richter?
Kleiber absolutely loved Richter and vice versa.
Thanks for this link. I have not heard yet, but will.To compare,I'll first listen to my Richter-Kondrashin Dvorak recorded in 1961.

Here is what Richter apparently said per " Notebooks and Conversations":

"It was in Philadelphia that I played it for the first tine, before making a recording - much later - with Carlos Kleiber. It's not a good recording, I'm afraid, because the atmosphere wasn't good.One of the players, idle as always - the oboist or horn player, if my memory serves - had said to him: 'If you continue to make remarks like that, I'm leaving.' To speak like that toKleiber,the greatest living conductor ! I was furious. Besides , I wasn't on form and neither was Kleiber.Be that as it may, it's a very attractive concerto, perhaps not as successful as the cello concerto, although that's a matter for debate."

maestrob
Posts: 5462
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:30 am

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by maestrob » Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:27 am

Rach3 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:44 am
Belle wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:37 pm
What do you think of the Dvorak Piano Concerto which Kleiber recorded with Richter?
Kleiber absolutely loved Richter and vice versa.
Thanks for this link. I have not heard yet, but will.To compare,I'll first listen to my Richter-Kondrashin Dvorak recorded in 1961.

Here is what Richter apparently said per " Notebooks and Conversations":

"It was in Philadelphia that I played it for the first tine, before making a recording - much later - with Carlos Kleiber. It's not a good recording, I'm afraid, because the atmosphere wasn't good.One of the players, idle as always - the oboist or horn player, if my memory serves - had said to him: 'If you continue to make remarks like that, I'm leaving.' To speak like that toKleiber,the greatest living conductor ! I was furious. Besides , I wasn't on form and neither was Kleiber.Be that as it may, it's a very attractive concerto, perhaps not as successful as the cello concerto, although that's a matter for debate."
Unsurprisingly, I agree with Richter's honest assessment of the recording. It's simply not good. Others I would recommend include Firkusny, and the one (w/ Garrick Olson) included in the complete set of Dvorak's Symphonies recently recorded by Belohlavek and the Czech Philharmonic.

SONNET CLV
Posts: 626
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:28 am
Location: Paradise, Montana

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by SONNET CLV » Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:54 pm

I'm old enough to have LPs of Dvorak's Fifth Symphony which is actually the Ninth Symphony. Don't sell us old-timers short, but … if an orchestra were to advertise a performance of the Dvorak Fifth, perhaps a few folks will show up expecting to hear the "From the New World". Not me, of course, but perhaps some.

By the way, the Dvorak Fifth (the actual Fifth) remains one of my favorite Romantic symphonies and it receives regular workouts on my stereo equipment. I have several recordings of the work.

Belle
Posts: 1255
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:45 am

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by Belle » Fri Sep 07, 2018 5:26 pm

Rach3 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:44 am
Belle wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:37 pm
What do you think of the Dvorak Piano Concerto which Kleiber recorded with Richter?
Kleiber absolutely loved Richter and vice versa.
Thanks for this link. I have not heard yet, but will.To compare,I'll first listen to my Richter-Kondrashin Dvorak recorded in 1961.

Here is what Richter apparently said per " Notebooks and Conversations":

"It was in Philadelphia that I played it for the first tine, before making a recording - much later - with Carlos Kleiber. It's not a good recording, I'm afraid, because the atmosphere wasn't good.One of the players, idle as always - the oboist or horn player, if my memory serves - had said to him: 'If you continue to make remarks like that, I'm leaving.' To speak like that toKleiber,the greatest living conductor ! I was furious. Besides , I wasn't on form and neither was Kleiber.Be that as it may, it's a very attractive concerto, perhaps not as successful as the cello concerto, although that's a matter for debate."
Wonderful anecdote! I'm surprised to read that he thought Kleiber 'wasn't on form' as it is one of so very few recordings we have of the conductor. It sounded well enough to me when I listened to it, but I'm not really too familiar with this work anyway.

Rach3
Posts: 408
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:17 am

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by Rach3 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:02 pm

Belle wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 5:26 pm
I'm surprised to read that he thought Kleiber 'wasn't on form' as it is one of so very few recordings we have of the conductor.
Richter made 3 other negative comments about his Dvorak PC recording with Kleiber I did not post here earlier. Here are 2 clips :

"Kleiber and I were rather tense at the time of the recording , we concentrated too hard and the work ( exceedingly tricky for the piano ) suddenly lost its freshness..."

"Carlos kept splitting hairs, and I myself was very tense. Hence the absence of the charm and simplicity so characteristic of Dvorak."

He also did not like his 1961 recording in London ( live ) with Kondrashin, saying when in London Richter " always felt very ill at ease."

Interestingly, Richter said it took him 3 years to learn the Dvorak PC, 2 months to learn the Bartok PC # 2 !!

Richter was a big Grieg fan ; I have a 1968 live in Bergen with the Bergen Symphony under David Oistrakh.Certainly not mawkish playing , a complaint Richter has about most performances of the Grieg PC. " .... Grieg,for example , of whom I'm very fond and who's a remarkable composer,almost a genius.Alfred Brendel says that it's music for a chambermaid.May God have mercy upon him! "

Rach3
Posts: 408
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:17 am

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by Rach3 » Sat Sep 08, 2018 10:42 am

Rach3 wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:02 pm
Richter was a big Grieg fan ... " Grieg,for example , of whom I'm very fond and who's a remarkable composer,almost a genius.Alfred Brendel says that it's music for a chambermaid.May God have mercy upon him! "

From the following YT post :

"I consider this recording of the Grieg Concerto with Matacic one of my genuine successes. Even after listening to it several times, I haven't changed my mind. I only hope that I am not wrong.""I've always liked the Grieg Concerto. I like it for its ruggedness, virility and coldness: a bracing north wind blows through it, and when the piano enters in the second movement, you'd think you could hear a bird singing from the top of a tall pine tree. I also like it for its originality and its total absence of mawkishness."--Richter

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQ2myoP2wZI

With Lovro von Matačić conducting the Orchestre National de l'Opéra de Monte Carlo in 1974.

A cd with both this Grieg and the Dvorak PC with Kleiber :

https://tinyurl.com/y7r6vfba

Lance
Site Administrator
Posts: 17519
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:27 am
Location: Binghamton, New York
Contact:

Re: Dvorak Symphony 5

Post by Lance » Sat Sep 08, 2018 11:06 am

Ah ... so THAT'S why Alfred Brendel never recorded any of Grieg's music (that I can immediately think of)! Music for a chamberpot? Err ... chambermaid.
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________

When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]

Image

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 21 guests