The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

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JackC
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The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by JackC » Fri Oct 01, 2010 9:05 am

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... Collection

In asking for a "waiver", McDonalds is essentially saying to the Obama administration - either exempt us from the healthcare law or it will dump the low-end coverage that it currently offers to 30,000 employees. (Anyone remember Obama saying something like - "Don't worry, trust me, if you like your current plan, you can keep it." :lol: )

McDonalds is hardly the only company that is in this position, so we can count on lots of companies asking for similar "waivers". The Obama adminstration is going to have to cave on this, and has already said that it will be "flexible" in reviewing these "requests". :lol:

This is a good example of the law of unintended consequences. The administration rammed through a terrible, ad hoc patchwork bill because it couldn't get what it wanted but felt it NEEDED, for political reasons, to pass something.

Well, bad call. The bill is just as unpopular as the day it was rammed through and is killing Democrats politically. Now the bad aspects of it are starting to become apparent, and a lot more is on the way. The Dems would be better off to allow this turkey to be repealed now than to allow it to become an albatross on their necks going forward.

jbuck919
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by jbuck919 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:06 pm

I thought this was going to be a report that Clinton has had a nervous breakdown.

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
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keaggy220
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by keaggy220 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:21 pm

JackC wrote:The Dems would be better off to allow this turkey to be repealed now than to allow it to become an albatross on their necks going forward.
It's actually an albatross around every Americans neck. Without a doubt the worst, largest, most expensive and most unpopular piece of legislation to be forced on Americans in a very long time. It didn't help that the liberal obsession to pass this was happening when everyone was waiting for the government to be serious about the economy.
"I guess we're all, or most of us, the wards of the nineteenth-century sciences which denied existence of anything it could not reason or explain. The things we couldn't explain went right on but not with our blessing... So many old and lovely things are stored in the world's attic, because we don't want them around us and we don't dare throw them out."
— John Steinbeck, The Winter of Our Discontent


"He has shown you, O mortal, what is good.
And what does the LORD require of you?
To act justly and to love mercy
and to walk humbly with your God."
- Micah 6:8

Cosima___J
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by Cosima___J » Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:24 pm

Anybody with half a brain knew before the Health Care "Reform" bill was passed that Obama's statement that "if you are happy with your health coverage, you can keep it" was a flat out lie.

The mini med plans are probably used by many employers. But now, forget it.

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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by jbuck919 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:31 pm

I know: Let's scrap the whole thing and go with single payer, aka (reformed) Medicare for everyone, as we should have in the first place!

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

Cosima___J
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by Cosima___J » Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:34 pm

Well John, you may get your wish. Since McDonalds and probably a string of others may be forced to drop coverage, I think it's obvious that your suggestion is what was intended all along. :evil:

jbuck919
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by jbuck919 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:51 pm

Cosima___J wrote:Well John, you may get your wish. Since McDonalds and probably a string of others may be forced to drop coverage, I think it's obvious that your suggestion is what was intended all along. :evil:
You are thinking of Medicaid. I am thinking of single-payer national health insurance. That bunches of Americans, like you, might assume that the two alternatives are minimal and inadequate private employer health insurance or welfare in the poor-house sense is almost definitive of our problem.

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

Cosima___J
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by Cosima___J » Fri Oct 01, 2010 5:03 pm

No, I'm not thinking of Medicaid.

What I'm wondering is how many other employers offer that same sort of Mini Med plan that McDonald's was offering its employees. If McDonalds can't get the waiver, maybe they just won't offer any insurance at all. Well isn't that just a delightful outcome of the health care reform.

jbuck919
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by jbuck919 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 5:18 pm

Cosima___J wrote:No, I'm not thinking of Medicaid.

What I'm wondering is how many other employers offer that same sort of Mini Med plan that McDonald's was offering its employees. If McDonalds can't get the waiver, maybe they just won't offer any insurance at all. Well isn't that just a delightful outcome of the health care reform.
Do you remember the show The Honeymooners? The episode where Ralph thinks he's inherited a fortune and so starts filling his dump of an apartment with expensive new purchases, it never occurring to him that the first thing he should do is move to a better place? That's the mentality I sense at work when it is assumed that the inadequacies of the old way of doing things should be preserved because they were better than nothing. The whole point is that barely better than nothing is no longer to be our standard, that now everyone will have access to adequate insurance one way or the other. The point is adequate coverage, not bestowing eternal life on a hodgepodge of obsolete employer programs.

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

Cosima___J
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by Cosima___J » Fri Oct 01, 2010 6:03 pm

The Honeymooners? Sheesh! How old do you think I am?

jbuck919
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by jbuck919 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 6:36 pm

Cosima___J wrote:The Honeymooners? Sheesh! How old do you think I am?
It was on in reruns for decades. :)

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

keaggy220
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by keaggy220 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 7:54 pm

jbuck919 wrote:
Cosima___J wrote:No, I'm not thinking of Medicaid.

What I'm wondering is how many other employers offer that same sort of Mini Med plan that McDonald's was offering its employees. If McDonalds can't get the waiver, maybe they just won't offer any insurance at all. Well isn't that just a delightful outcome of the health care reform.
Do you remember the show The Honeymooners? The episode where Ralph thinks he's inherited a fortune and so starts filling his dump of an apartment with expensive new purchases, it never occurring to him that the first thing he should do is move to a better place? That's the mentality I sense at work when it is assumed that the inadequacies of the old way of doing things should be preserved because they were better than nothing. The whole point is that barely better than nothing is no longer to be our standard, that now everyone will have access to adequate insurance one way or the other. The point is adequate coverage, not bestowing eternal life on a hodgepodge of obsolete employer programs.
The problem is we didn't inherit a fortune. We've inherited big government, old liberal ideas... We've filled our apartment with what we thought was gold - and paid dearly for it. But it turned out to be fools gold.
"I guess we're all, or most of us, the wards of the nineteenth-century sciences which denied existence of anything it could not reason or explain. The things we couldn't explain went right on but not with our blessing... So many old and lovely things are stored in the world's attic, because we don't want them around us and we don't dare throw them out."
— John Steinbeck, The Winter of Our Discontent


"He has shown you, O mortal, what is good.
And what does the LORD require of you?
To act justly and to love mercy
and to walk humbly with your God."
- Micah 6:8

ch1525
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by ch1525 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 10:15 pm

jbuck919 wrote:
Cosima___J wrote:The Honeymooners? Sheesh! How old do you think I am?
It was on in reruns for decades. :)
Believe it or not, I've seen almost every episode and I'm only 25! :D

RebLem
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by RebLem » Fri Oct 01, 2010 10:49 pm

jbuck919 wrote:
Cosima___J wrote:The Honeymooners? Sheesh! How old do you think I am?
It was on in reruns for decades. :)
I saw them all in first run. :x
Don't drink and drive. You might spill it.--J. Eugene Baker, aka my late father
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RebLem
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by RebLem » Fri Oct 01, 2010 10:58 pm

jbuck919 wrote:I know: Let's scrap the whole thing and go with single payer, aka (reformed) Medicare for everyone, as we should have in the first place!
I second the motion.

The rank duplicity of the GOPers & RW Dems is demonstrated on this issue as on few others. First, they told us they might vote for health care reform if we abandoned single payer, and then, even the public option. So, we abandoned the public option, and it passed with the support of a few RW Dems, but no GOPers.

Then, the GOPers and RW Dems turn around and sue the government saying the bill is unconstitutional because it requires people to buy from private companies, a condition they had insisted upon in the first place. What a bunch of weasels!

Single payer is constitutional. Medicare is single payer and financed mostly through taxes, has been tested in the courts, and been determined constitutional. Now we just need to expand it for everyone, adding a prescription drug benefit for all.
Don't drink and drive. You might spill it.--J. Eugene Baker, aka my late father
"We're not generating enough angry white guys to stay in business for the long term."--Sen. Lindsey Graham, R-S. Carolina.
"Racism is America's Original Sin."--Francis Cardinal George, former Roman Catholic Archbishop of Chicago.

JackC
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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by JackC » Fri Oct 01, 2010 11:51 pm

RebLem wrote:
jbuck919 wrote:I know: Let's scrap the whole thing and go with single payer, aka (reformed) Medicare for everyone, as we should have in the first place!
I second the motion.

The rank duplicity of the GOPers & RW Dems is demonstrated on this issue as on few others. First, they told us they might vote for health care reform if we abandoned single payer, and then, even the public option. So, we abandoned the public option, and it passed with the support of a few RW Dems, but no GOPers.

Then, the GOPers and RW Dems turn around and sue the government saying the bill is unconstitutional because it requires people to buy from private companies, a condition they had insisted upon in the first place. What a bunch of weasels!

Single payer is constitutional. Medicare is single payer and financed mostly through taxes, has been tested in the courts, and been determined constitutional. Now we just need to expand it for everyone, adding a prescription drug benefit for all.
Well sorry to report that only a very few people wanted that. It must be very frustrating that all the people who you think should want it don't want it. The idiots!! :roll:

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Re: The Beginning of the Unraveling of the Worst Bill Ever?

Post by RebLem » Mon Oct 04, 2010 6:24 am

A number of people here have been propagating the damnable lie that the US has the best health care in the world and that lots of Europeans come here to get health care. Over in the Chatterbox, Donaldopato has posted that Riccardo Muti has cancelled the rest of his fall concerts in Chicago because he is ill. The article says Muti is returning to Italy to consult with his doctors.

http://www.herald-review.com/entertainm ... 43244.html

The Chicago Symphony Orchestra has announced that music director Riccardo Muti is withdrawing from the rest of his fall residency because of illness, but officials hope he'll be back this winter.

The Italian conductor is suffering from "extreme gastric distress" and has to fly back to Milan to consult with his doctors, according to a statement Sunday from the CSO Association.
Don't drink and drive. You might spill it.--J. Eugene Baker, aka my late father
"We're not generating enough angry white guys to stay in business for the long term."--Sen. Lindsey Graham, R-S. Carolina.
"Racism is America's Original Sin."--Francis Cardinal George, former Roman Catholic Archbishop of Chicago.

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