The Terrible Batman Movie Tragedy

[lennygoran]

We DVR the news every morning from the Today Show and watch it in the morning at our own convenience--the whole first half hour was devoted to the Colorado tragedy--my only movie going experiences these days is the Met HD broadcasts at a large 16 screen complex in the Rockaway Mall--I couldn't even imagine what I would do if something like that happened while I was in a movie house:

"(CNN) -- The first witness accounts to surface from a deadly shooting in Aurora, Colorado, painted a surreal picture of what happened inside Theater 9 of Century Aurora movie theater."

Now I see the guy has been identified:
A suspect was captured at the scene. Federal officials have identified him as 24-year-old James Holmes.

Update at 8:39 a.m. ET: The FBI tells NBC NEWS that the suspect was driving a car with Tennessee license tags but had been living locally.

Update at 8:35 a.m. ET: CNN quotes Frank Fania, a police spokesman, as saying the gunman "did not resist. He did not put up a fight."

Fania says police seized a rifle and a handgun from the suspect, and another gun was found in the theater, CNN reports.

Regards, Len

[John F]

So what happened? And what does Batman have to do with it? You left out a few details.

[lennygoran]

So what happened? And what does Batman have to do with it? You left out a few details.

You gotta know what happened--it's all over the news and is constantly being updated!

Okay here's the Times link:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/21/us/co ... ng.html?hp

Regards, Len

[living_stradivarius]

http://www.kpho.com/story/19071381/gunm ... ed-theater

[John F]

You gotta know what happened--it's all over the news and is constantly being updated!

No I don't. Sensational stories like this frankly don't interest me much; what have they to do with me, or I with them? Colorado is more than 2,000 miles away, and now and then someone out there gets trigger-happy, cf. Columbine High School. We have problems of our own here in New York City, though they may not be "all over the news" - did you know?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/0 ... 59696.html

Something about the 4th of July week brings out the killer in some New Yorkers; this year it was 16 homicides in 5 days. Now that's something it's useful for a New Yorker to know about.

[lennygoran]

I'm surprised at your answer but to each his own. I much preferred the reaction of President Obama.

"President Barack Obama said he and first lady Michelle Obama were "shocked and saddened" by the shooting and pledged the administration's support for victims of the shooting. "As we do when confronted by moments of darkness and challenge, we must now come together as one American family," Obama said. President Barack Obama said he and first lady Michelle Obama were "shocked and saddened" by the shooting and pledged the administration's support for victims of the shooting."

and closer to home this:


"Warner Bros., the studio behind the movie, said the company and filmmakers were "deeply saddened" to learn of the incident. The studio canceled the movie's Paris premiere, while New York police Commissioner Raymond Kelly said his officers would watch over screenings of "The Dark Knight" to prevent copycat shootings."

And I have to admit that the other tragedies like Columbine and the Virginia Tech massacre attract my attention too. Regards, Len

[John F]

President Obama is President of Colorado as well as New York, and politics require him to say things like that, however he may personally feel about them. As for Chief Kelly's comment, that's his professional responsibility. I haven't gone to a movie theatre in many years, so as I said, this has nothing to do with me personally. Others may differ.

As for your surprise that I don't pay attention to sensational events in faraway places, just because they're sensational, I might equally say I'm surprised that you ignored the story I just linked to, about even worse carnage in a city you often visit, which has direct personal relevance to you and could be useful to know. But not much surprises me any more.

[lennygoran]

I might equally say I'm surprised that you ignored the story I just linked to, about even worse carnage in a city you often visit, which has direct personal relevance to you and could be useful to know. But not much surprises me any more.

But I didn't ignore that--aamof I've been concerned and worried about NYC crime all my life. Ironically the link you provided also had Mayor Mike's reaction to the Aurora story.

"Michael Bloomberg, NYC Mayor, Reacts To Colorado Shooting

New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg called on President Barack Obama and GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney Friday to detail their views to improve gun control in wake of the mass shooting at an Aurora, Colorado movie theater that left at least 12 dead and scores wounded. The suspected gunman, now identified as 24-year-old James Holmes, opened fire during a premier of "The Dark Knight Rises."

"You know, soothing words are nice, but maybe it’s time that the two people who want to be President of the United States stand up and tell us what they are going to do about it, because this is obviously a problem across the country," Bloomberg said, referencing early morning statements from both Obama and Romney, during his weekly appearance on WORS radio. "

Regards, Len

[diegobueno]

My brother lives in the Arvada area of Denver, not very far from Aurora, so the story affects me very much. He doesn't go to movies in the theater (he waits for the DVD) and he's not interested in Batman movies, so I never had any worry that he would be in any danger. Still, I don't like things like that to happen in a city where my brother is.

The gunman chose to open fire during a gunfight scene, and set off smoke bombs so the audience couldn't distinguish the shots in the film from the real shots aimed at them. That's a level of verisimiltude in movies I can do without.

[lennygoran]

My brother lives in the Arvada area of Denver, not very far from Aurora, so the story affects me very much. He doesn't go to movies in the theater (he waits for the DVD) and he's not interested in Batman movies, so I never had any worry that he would be in any danger. Still, I don't like things like that to happen in a city where my brother is.

I decided to check the AMC cinemas that I go to for the HD Met performances--they are doing some this summer but none were on the schedule for tonight. However they were performing The Dark Knight Rises tonight as well as a movie named believe it or not: "Safety Not Guaranteed ." One thing I learned on the news was that one of the bullets fired had gone from the Dark Knight Theater into another theater next to it and had actually wounded someone in that theater! Scary terrible stuff. Regards, Len

[Steinway]

This horrific story speaks once again about the American gun culture and the obsession most people in this country have for firearms.

The ease that this nutcase had in legally obtaining automatic weapons and the ammunition sufficient to slaughter scores of innocents should, but course won't underscore the power of the NRA and the weakness of politicians to ban these guns from being available to anyone other than law enforcement people.

This incident should make everyone very angry. It apparently strikes some folks as just another regular day in America, so let's just shrug our shoulders and move on.

Pathetic.

[lennygoran]

This incident should make everyone very angry. It apparently strikes some folks as just another regular day in America, so let's just shrug our shoulders and move on.

Pathetic.

Gotta agree with you-a terrible event--everyone should realize that!

Locally

"Members of the Denver Comic Con are working with state officials to organize a candlelight vigil this Sunday, in Aurora and have also enlisted the help from Mental Health America of Colorado to help provide grief counseling during the vigil, for any member of the community who may have been affected by this tragedy."

and on a more national level:

"On Friday, Obama and Romney swiftly stripped their day of overt campaigning that surely would have seemed crass given the enormity of the tragedy. They scrambled to yank all their television spots, attack ads or otherwise, from Colorado stations — though strongly critical ads continued elsewhere. Both campaigns pulled their top surrogates off the politically driven talk shows this Sunday.

Nothing else mattered as the country absorbed the news that a man opened fire on people watching the new Batman movie in an Aurora, Colo., theater outside Denver. Twelve people were killed and dozens more were wounded by a suspect said to be using an assault rifle, a shotgun and a handgun in the attack...
In Florida, Obama was notified at dawn about the shootings. He canceled a second Florida event and came back to the White House, immediately getting an Oval Office briefing about the investigation. The U.S. flag at the White House was lowered to half-staff, and Obama ordered similar action at all federal facilities."

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/art ... 9def224d44

Regards, Len

[John F]

If I got angry at everything bad that happens in this country, let alone in the rest of the world where many millions of people are starving to death, being abused and killed by their own governments, etc. etc., then life would hardly be worth living, would it? You want something worth getting angry about, consider that 10,000 Syrians have been killed by the military of their own country since their protest began, sometimes 250 or more in a day. Or are American deaths the only ones that matter?



As for Colorado, what can we do but shrug our shoulders and move on? Why is it better to get angry and move on? Nobody here is actually going to do anything about it, if we're honest; there's nothing any of us can do. Might as well save our anger for when it might possibly be put to some constructive use.

[Daisy]

This horrific story speaks once again about the American gun culture and the obsession most people in this country have for firearms.

The ease that this nutcase had in legally obtaining automatic weapons and the ammunition sufficient to slaughter scores of innocents should, but course won't underscore the power of the NRA and the weakness of politicians to ban these guns from being available to anyone other than law enforcement people.

Oh, please don't turn this into a political issue. I thought it was exactly right that both Obama and Romney said what they said on TV, and they left the politics out of it. Gun control isn't the issue here, because no matter how many guns you control, people like this always seem to find a way to do their dirty deeds.

You had a brilliant-but-crazy boy who identified with Supervillains, and decided to act on that fantasy, period. As my son remarked, "Ah, Alfred...if only he had used his brilliance for Good instead of Evil..."

[Tarantella]

Americans have our deepest sympathy for yet another local act of senseless violence. We had our own in Australia some years ago when a nutcase shot 31 people one afternoon. And, of course, the people of Norway know all about it. (We were due to arrive in Oslo within days of that shooting!!)

There is an answer to most problems (except terminal illness) and that answer resides in the political will and whether the 'answers' will be palatable. Whether that be gun control, mental health identification, management and control orders (being enforced!), proper and effective law enforcement, it all requires the collective to be supportive. And I just know, from experience in my country, whenever these things have been discussed civil 'libertarians' destroy the debate in seconds. They aren't intelligent enough to realize that people have to be prepared to die so that the rights of 'civil libertarians' can be protected!! I agree with John F, 'nothing will be done'. And, please, don't tell me the jerk who did this hadn't come to somebody's attention - classmates, the local gun shop, family, neighbours, 'friends, etc.!!!

[RebLem]

You gotta know what happened--it's all over the news and is constantly being updated!

No I don't. Sensational stories like this frankly don't interest me much; what have they to do with me, or I with them? Colorado is more than 2,000 miles away, and now and then someone out there gets trigger-happy, cf. Columbine High School. We have problems of our own here in New York City, though they may not be "all over the news" - did you know?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/0 ... 59696.html

Something about the 4th of July week brings out the killer in some New Yorkers; this year it was 16 homicides in 5 days. Now that's something it's useful for a New Yorker to know about.

No man is an island,
Entire of itself.
Each is a piece of the continent,
A part of the main.
If a clod be washed away by the sea,
Europe is the less.
As well as if a promontory were.
As well as if a manor of thine own
Or of thine friend's were.
Each man's death diminishes me,
For I am involved in mankind.
Therefore, send not to know
For whom the bell tolls,
It tolls for thee.

--John Donne, 1572-1631

[lennygoran]

If I got angry at everything bad that happens in this country, let alone in the rest of the world where many millions of people are starving to death, being abused and killed by their own governments, etc. etc., then life would hardly be worth living, would it? You want something worth getting angry about, consider that 10,000 Syrians have been killed by the military of their own country since their protest began, sometimes 250 or more in a day. Or are American deaths the only ones that matter?



As for Colorado, what can we do but shrug our shoulders and move on? Why is it better to get angry and move on? Nobody here is actually going to do anything about it, if we're honest; there's nothing any of us can do. Might as well save our anger for when it might possibly be put to some constructive use.

I don't buy your answer on many accounts--first of all you criticized me for being more concerned about that tragic event than about NYC which incidentally was wrong--now you bring up Syria much further away. Secondly this tragedy again focuses in on how easy it is to get guns in this country--Mayor Mike has it right and he was right to speak out. Thirdly I can't do much about any of these tragedies, Syria or the latest massacre except voice being upset. BTW I can be upset by a lot of things at once--they are not mutually exclusive. Sometimes I feel your statements go a little overboard.

This statement of yours is one of those I feel goes overboard but as I said--to each his own:
"Sensational stories like this frankly don't interest me much; what have they to do with me, or I with them? Colorado is more than 2,000 miles away, and now and then someone out there gets trigger-happy, cf. Columbine High School. We have problems of our own here in New York City, though they may not be "all over the news" Regards, Len

[lennygoran]

I agree with John F, 'nothing will be done'. And, please, don't tell me the jerk who did this hadn't come to somebody's attention - classmates, the local gun shop, family, neighbours, 'friends, etc.!!!

I have to disagree--we try to get things done but right now in the USA there's a log-jam--Should I just give up, never vote and forget politics. Isn't it better to at least try to support the candidate you believe can help us the most? Obama may not be perfect but even if he is only there to appoint the next round of Supreme Court Justices it will be worth the effort--nope I think things can be done. Regards, Len

[John F]

Editorial
The Shootings in Colorado
Published: July 20, 2012

The most appropriate response now to the shootings early Friday in Aurora, Colo., is also the simplest: sympathy for the victims, for the injured and for their families.

[What's that? Not anger? Whaddaya know. /John F]

President Obama asked a crowd in Fort Myers, Fla., “to pause in a moment of silence for the victims of this terrible tragedy, for the people who knew them and loved them, for those who are still struggling to recover, and for all the victims of less publicized acts of violence that plague our communities every single day.”

He returned to the White House and, like Mitt Romney, pulled his political ads off the air in Colorado.

Mr. Romney addressed the senseless violence at a previously scheduled campaign stop in New Hampshire.

“I stand before you today not as a man running for office but as a father and grandfather, a husband, an American,” he said. “This is a time for each of us to look into our hearts and remember how much we love one another and how much we love and how much we care for our great country.”

Both men struck absolutely the right note. The country needs a pause for reflection, to wait for more information and to take a break from this ugly political campaign. But as Mayor Michael Bloomberg of New York, a leader in the search for sensible answers about guns, said, we will need to do more than reflect. “Maybe,” the mayor said, “it’s time that the two people who want to be president of the United States stand up and tell us what they’re going to do about it.”

Sadly, however, it seems unlikely that they will tell us what they are going to do about it, or that there will be a national dialogue about it, just as there was no national dialogue after Columbine or after Virginia Tech or after Jared Lee Loughner tried to assassinate then-Representative Gabrielle Giffords.

Politicians are far too fearful of the gun lobby to address gun violence, and, as a society, we keep getting stuck on a theoretical debate about the Second Amendment, which keeps us from taking practical measures that just might help avoid the all-too-frequent tragedies like the one in Aurora.

Whether you believe, as many perfectly reasonable people do, that the amendment gives each individual the right to bear arms, or whether you believe, as this editorial page has often argued, that it is society’s right to raising a militia, there is no excuse to ignore the out-of-control gun market.

The country needs laws that allow gun ownership, but laws that also control their sale and use in careful ways. Instead, we have been seeing a rash of “stand your ground” self-defense laws, other laws that recklessly encourage the carrying of concealed weapons, and efforts to force every state to knuckle under to those laws. Assault rifles like one used by the killer in Colorado are too readily available, as are high-capacity ammunition clips.

What we do not need is more heedless rhetoric like we heard on Friday from Representative Louie Gohmert, the Texas Republican who drew a bizarre connection during a radio interview between the horror in Colorado and “ongoing attacks on Judeo-Christian beliefs.” Mr. Gohmert added: “It does make me wonder, you know, with all those people in the theater, was there nobody that was carrying? That could have stopped this guy more quickly?”

That sort of call to vigilante justice is sadly too familiar, and it may be the single most dangerous idea in the debate over gun ownership.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/21/opini ... orado.html

[lennygoran]

Editorial
The Shootings in Colorado
Published: July 20, 2012

The most appropriate response now to the shootings early Friday in Aurora, Colo., is also the simplest: sympathy for the victims, for the injured and for their families.

Now you're talking! Regards, Len

[Guitarist]

"SMITH & WESSON:PROVIDING WEAPONS FOR MASS MURDERERS SINCE 1852"

[Mark Harwood]

The British newspapers mostly headlined with this horrible incident as though the name of the movie were one of its salient features. Weird.
So much sadness, such horror for so many people. What a species we are.

[lennygoran]

The British newspapers mostly headlined with this horrible incident as though the name of the movie were one of its salient features. Weird.
So much sadness, such horror for so many people. What a species we are.

Here in the US we let the assault rifle ban expire--what does this say about that species in our country. Wasn't an assault rifle the major weapon used in this horrible case? Didn't Romney once support a ban when governor of Ma.? And on April 16, 2009, President Obama stated that he will not push for the reinstatement of the Assault Weapons Ban in the United States even though he still believes that it "made sense." I'll tell you, thinking about Wayne LaPierre and George Norcross and Citizens United can make one very sad. Regards, Len

[jbuck919]

No man is an island,
Entire of itself.
Each is a piece of the continent,
A part of the main.
If a clod be washed away by the sea,
Europe is the less.
As well as if a promontory were.
As well as if a manor of thine own
Or of thine friend's were.
Each man's death diminishes me,
For I am involved in mankind.
Therefore, send not to know
For whom the bell tolls,
It tolls for thee.

--John Donne, 1572-1631

Um, it's not a poem--it is a prose statement from Devotions upon emergent occasions. (Where is John F when we need him?)

However, you have offered a famous philosophical/literary exposition of why we should all care, which is the more convincing (or at least the last sentence is) when one considers that the next attack could be in Albuquerque or upstate New York or Brooklyn.

[John F]

However, you have offered a famous philosophical/literary exposition of why we should all care

Do you mean we should all care about the death of "every man" (and presumably every woman) in the world? Are you so "involved in mankind" that you personally feel "diminished" by every one of the 153,781 deaths than happen on average every day? If not, then what do you mean?

The average daily mortality worldwide was considerably lower in John Donne's time, of course, and much of the world was unknown to him and his European contemporaries anyway. But can we believe that he himself actually felt "diminished" by every death, every day, just because he was "involved with mankind"? Surely not.

Nor should we take Donne's pronouncement as definitive just because he said it, or because he said it eloquently. If so, then we would have to sign on to much else that he said, such as this, which follows immediately after "It tolls for thee":

Neither can we call this a begging of misery, or a borrowing of misery, as though we were not miserable enough of ourselves, but must fetch in more from the next house, in taking upon us the misery of our neighbours. Truly it were an excusable covetousness if we did, for affliction is a treasure, and scarce any man hath enough of it.

I suppose we are free to pick and choose the parts of Donne's meditation that suit our own feelings and beliefs, and ignore the rest. But if Donne is taken to be an authority, and his religious views and preachings to be authoritative, then we ought to take them all. And if not, then we are free to leave them all.

On the other matter, sorry to disappoint you. RebLem doesn't say the Donne quotation is a poem, he got the words right, and if his source added line breaks to emphasize Donne's rhetorical structure and cadences, and RebLem didn't iron them out, I don't mind.

[absinthe]

This horrific story speaks once again about the American gun culture and the obsession most people in this country have for firearms.

The ease that this nutcase had in legally obtaining automatic weapons and the ammunition sufficient to slaughter scores of innocents should, but course won't underscore the power of the NRA and the weakness of politicians to ban these guns from being available to anyone other than law enforcement people.

Ban guns? The UK has some of the tightest gun laws in the world but it hasn't stopped gun crime. The law merely pushed the problem underground. Quite aside from the fact that banning guns doesn't ban violent idiots.

[lennygoran]

when one considers that the next attack could be in Albuquerque or upstate New York or Brooklyn.

Sure scare me right when we'll be heading to upstate NY less than a week from now! Regards, Len

[jbuck919]

when one considers that the next attack could be in Albuquerque or upstate New York or Brooklyn.

Sure scare me right when we'll be heading to upstate NY less than a week from now! Regards, Len

I forgot to add Port Murray, NJ.

[lennygoran]

when one considers that the next attack could be in Albuquerque or upstate New York or Brooklyn.

Sure scare me right when we'll be heading to upstate NY less than a week from now! Regards, Len

I forgot to add Port Murray, NJ. [

Yes even out here in my boonies we have a large movie complex-
About 16 screens 10 minutes from where we live-same complex
As where my shoprite is located. Len

[John F]

According to the National Association of Theatre Owners, there are 39,000 "movie screens" (more than one per movie house) in the United States. In exactly one of them some guy came in and shot up the audience, one day in 365. With those odds, why should you be shivering in your shoes? You're probably in greater danger driving to the theatre than when you get there.

[jbuck919]

According to the National Association of Theatre Owners, there are 39,000 "movie screens" (more than one per movie house) in the United States. In exactly one of them some guy came in and shot up the audience, one day in 365. With those odds, why should you be shivering in your shoes? You're probably in greater danger driving to the theatre than when you get there.

What a marvelous job you're doing standing in for Corlyss [not fleeing].