Revealing Trump interview...

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 1:27 am

It looks like it wasn't even an interview response about her, but him watching her on TV with a bunch of other people. Maybe my theory is wrong...

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:15 am

This was all over the network news this morning. If Trump says anything crass or controversial, the MSM has got to make sure everyone knows....

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:17 am

This just posted today. Trump now surges to 32% and due to significant gains from women. Go figure:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/10/politics/ ... index.html

Auntie Lynn · Post by **Auntie Lynn** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:11 am

Months ago, someone said: In this campaign, you cannot be boring. Looks like The
Donald overcame that little hurdle from the start. Now everybody is trying to be like him
without much success. He can say just about anything he wants and get away with it. Oh,
BTW, Hillary sez: I’m sorry...isn't that precious!

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 12:20 pm

I agree Trump's campaign has unprecedentedly high entertainment value. The guy is like a cartoon character...it's really funny and entertaining.

Proton · Post by **Proton** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 4:49 pm

rwetmore wrote:
Proton wrote:Merely asserting that it's BS doesn't make it so,
No, it doesn't -- you're right.

Proton wrote:especially given Trump's well-documented history of racist rhetoric.
Where? I've watched virtually all of Trump's campaign events and media interviews in full, and I haven't seen it. I suspect you and so many others are not actually doing this, and are getting the accusations second hand from anti-Trump media sources.

Virtually all of his stuff since he started running is on youtube. Point me to the video and specific part of the video where he engages in racist rhetoric.

If you can't do this, then I stand by my position that it is BS.

In his post immediately after the one I'm responding to, Piston pointed out the following:
1) Trump's documented history of discrimination against blacks in the Real Estate arena.
2) Macy's, Univision, NBC, NASCAR, PGA, among other organizations, have all cut ties with Trump in reaction to his racist comments against Mexicans.
3) Trump is supported by white supremacists.

To which I would add that David Duke has endorsed Trump.

Here are some links detailing Trump's appeal to white-supremacists and other racists:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/don ... d3359dc41a

http://www.vocativ.com/news/206807/whit ... for-trump/

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... -them.html

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arc ... of/396467/

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/07/01 ... ist-image/

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/ ... lence.html

piston · Post by **piston** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 5:48 pm

Potentially good piece on "Fresh Air," in fifteen minutes, connecting Trump's popular (in some parts) "Mexican" deportation idea to what happened to U.S. Latinos during the Great Depression.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:04 am

Proton wrote:In his post immediately after the one I'm responding to, Piston pointed out the following:
1) Trump's documented history of discrimination against blacks in the Real Estate arena.
2) Macy's, Univision, NBC, NASCAR, PGA, among other organizations, have all cut ties with Trump in reaction to his racist comments against Mexicans.
3) Trump is supported by white supremacists.

To which I would add that David Duke has endorsed Trump.

Here are some links detailing Trump's appeal to white-supremacists and other racists:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/don ... d3359dc41a

http://www.vocativ.com/news/206807/whit ... for-trump/

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... -them.html

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arc ... of/396467/

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/07/01 ... ist-image/

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/ ... lence.html

I asked for specific instances (or even one instance) of racist rhetoric from Trump, and you have still yet to provide any. Accusations of racial discrimination by some part of his company years ago isn't racist rhetoric, nor is the fact that some radical or racially discriminating groups happen support him. He, nor any other candidate, has any control over that.

So again, I ask for an instance of actual racist rhetoric from Trump. I've been following his campaign pretty closely and I haven't seen it. It exists only in your mind in the minds of those who want him to be someone who is engaging in racist rhetoric, because it fits nicely into their world view.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:08 am

Here is the latest Trump event or press conference. Where is the racist rhetoric towards Hispanics or anyone else?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2Z25gz_wEg

There have been a number of campaign events and media interviews -- all are posted on youtube. Where is the racist rhetoric among them?

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:19 am

Trump responds directly to Fiorina comments on Greta Van Susteren:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/09 ... tcmp=hpbt2

lennygoran · Post by **lennygoran** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 6:03 am

rwetmore wrote:
I asked for specific instances (or even one instance)

Here's one:
"The U.S. has become a dumping ground for everybody else’s problems. … When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people."

And what about the put downs of women and those poor veterans who don't win-you'll forgive him for anything because you want him to win despite him having no answers to solve our problems. Regards, Len

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 7:06 am

lennygoran wrote:Here's one:
"The U.S. has become a dumping ground for everybody else’s problems. … When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people."

Again, what is racist in this statement? Nothing.

lennygoran wrote:And what about the put downs of women and those poor veterans who don't win-you'll forgive him for anything because you want him to win despite him having no answers to solve our problems. Regards, Len

What poor veterans that don't win? His derogatory remarks about some woman I won't deny, but I think a lot of it is tongue in cheek -- like in the case of Carly Fiorina.

karlhenning · Post by **karlhenning** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 7:07 am

lennygoran wrote:And what about the put downs of women and those poor veterans who don't win-you'll forgive him for anything because you want him to win despite him having no answers to solve our problems. Regards, Len :(

Gosh, Len, are there really people who want Trump to win? Is that medically possible? ; )

~Karl (fleeing . . . perhaps to Mexico)

lennygoran · Post by **lennygoran** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 7:42 am

rwetmore wrote:
What poor veterans that don't win?

I give up-you're hopeless. Regards, Len

karlhenning · Post by **karlhenning** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 7:48 am

lennygoran wrote:
rwetmore wrote: What poor veterans that don't win?
I give up-you're hopeless. Regards, Len :(

" . . . a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest."

Cheers,
~k.

piston · Post by **piston** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 8:04 am

I am just a poor boy
Though my story’s seldom told
I have squandered my resistance
For a pocketful of mumbles
Such are promises
All lies and jest
Still, a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest

Paul Simon

Proton · Post by **Proton** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 12:01 pm

rwetmore wrote:
Proton wrote:In his post immediately after the one I'm responding to, Piston pointed out the following:
1) Trump's documented history of discrimination against blacks in the Real Estate arena.
2) Macy's, Univision, NBC, NASCAR, PGA, among other organizations, have all cut ties with Trump in reaction to his racist comments against Mexicans.
3) Trump is supported by white supremacists.

To which I would add that David Duke has endorsed Trump.

Here are some links detailing Trump's appeal to white-supremacists and other racists:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/don ... d3359dc41a

http://www.vocativ.com/news/206807/whit ... for-trump/

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... -them.html

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arc ... of/396467/

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/07/01 ... ist-image/

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/ ... lence.html

rwetmore wrote:I asked for specific instances (or even one instance) of racist rhetoric from Trump, and you have still yet to provide any. Accusations of racial discrimination by some part of his company years ago isn't racist rhetoric, nor is the fact that some radical or racially discriminating groups happen support him. He, nor any other candidate, has any control over that.
On one or more of the links I provided, you could read a paragraph-long quote of Trump's in which he denigrated Mexicans as rapist and killers, among other things. The quote was widely disseminated and I have no doubt that you are already familiar with it, following Trump as closely as you do.

Now, I'm not so masochistic as to subject myself to hours of combing through every video of Trump on Youtube just to annotate the numerous incidences of racism and misogyny, complete with video timings for your convenience. That would be a fool's errand, as you would probably double down and claim that the quote was taken out of context and that somewhere there exists an unexpurgated video in which <b>The Whole Truth</b> is revealed.

Suppose I had typed out the quote verbatim. Again, I suspect you would double down and deny any racist content in the remarks.
Sorry, nagahappen.

rwetmore wrote:So again, I ask for an instance of actual racist rhetoric from Trump. I've been following his campaign pretty closely and I haven't seen it. It exists only in your mind in the minds of those who want him to be someone who is engaging in racist rhetoric, because it fits nicely into their world view.

Projecting your delusions onto others is no way to go through life, son.

Proton · Post by **Proton** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 12:18 pm

rwetmore wrote:
lennygoran wrote:Here's one:
"The U.S. has become a dumping ground for everybody else’s problems. … When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people."
Again, what is racist in this statement? Nothing.

Ayup, you're nothing if not predictable!

rwetmore wrote:
lennygoran wrote:And what about the put downs of women and those poor veterans who don't win-you'll forgive him for anything because you want him to win despite him having no answers to solve our problems. Regards, Len
What poor veterans that don't win? His derogatory remarks about some woman I won't deny, but I think a lot of it is tongue in cheek -- like in the case of Carly Fiorina.

Once again you're being disingenuous. You're really unaware of what Trump said about McCain having been a POW?
But, there's even more! Trump actually equated attending a military boarding school with actual military service, an absurd claim
that dishonors those of us who actually served.

In future appearances, Trump should be roundly laughed off stage by any veterans present in the audience.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 2:06 pm

Trump says by her 'face' he meant her persona -- not her looks. Now something tells me none of you are going to believe this, even though 'face' is a ubiquitously listed synonym for the word 'persona'.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 2:08 pm

lennygoran wrote:
rwetmore wrote:
What poor veterans that don't win?
I give up-you're hopeless. Regards, Len

What McCain?

karlhenning · Post by **karlhenning** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 2:18 pm

Oh, Lord . . . the funniest thing I have read today was "Donald Trump" and "foreign policy speech" in the same sentence.

Cheers,
~k.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Tue Sep 15, 2015 1:06 pm

Donald Trump: "Enough With the Nice!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwIL6imI6EU

Auntie Lynn · Post by **Auntie Lynn** » Tue Sep 15, 2015 3:08 pm

Trump Rally - 20,000
Walker Rally - 178

Anybody getting the picture yet..??

piston · Post by **piston** » Tue Sep 15, 2015 5:32 pm

The picture is of a candidate who repeats and repeats the same thing: "they are all stupid; I'm a great deal maker," whatever the political topic. This simplistic populist appeal is understandably scary to the GOP because it's working, even though there's no substantive message at all. The Donald can be ignorant about a lot of things, and he has demonstrated his ignorance time and again (the so-called "gotcha" questions), because people like you are satisfied that, whatever the issue, he's a great, successful dealmaker, notwithstanding bankruptcies, unethical behavior with lenders, incivility with opponents, and potential prejudices in his dealings with non-whites and women. You and millions of other angry white Americans see him as your Superman.

That's the picture.

Agnes Selby · Post by **Agnes Selby** » Tue Sep 15, 2015 6:14 pm

Somewhere in America there is a man called Trump
on his head he wears a blond hump
under the hump there is little brain
not much to cause him any pain.

The pain will come when he is selected
and more pain when he is elected.
He will tell Putin "you are fired"
and the woman Merkel, "you are not hired".

A self-loving tyrant he will be
all those who love him will soon see
the real Trump who loves only himself
and will let America take care of herself.

piston · Post by **piston** » Tue Sep 15, 2015 6:26 pm

A feminist response to Trump's views on Megyn Kelly and Carly Fiorina (and to all supporters of Trump):
https://fbcdn-creative-a.akamaihd.net/h ... 16be612a04

piston · Post by **piston** » Tue Sep 15, 2015 7:08 pm

Oh, believe me, he's going to have plenty of opposition for his b.s.:

piston · Post by **piston** » Tue Sep 15, 2015 7:12 pm

Not the least of which from those very Latinos you call "greasers":

"George Bush in 2004 wins 39, 40 percent of the Latino vote" after supporting comprehensive immigration reform, said Damore. But just eight years later, "Mitt Romney's in the low 20s," after saying that people who come to the U.S. illegally should "self-deport."

"So there's a big swing in a relatively short amount of time there."

Republican consultant Reed Galen doesn't like the trend.

"As a Republican who has to go win elections, I would like more people to like our candidates than less," he said, laughing. "That's sort of a baseline."

But with Donald Trump leading in the polls, it's undeniable that the talk about illegal immigration has struck a chord with part of the Republican base, said Galen.

"Do I believe that it has the ability to derail the party?" he asks. "Absolutely. Is it a long-term concern? Absolutely."

But in the short term it's hard to get candidates to think about anything but winning the nomination.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 1:00 am

piston wrote:The picture is of a candidate who repeats and repeats the same thing: "they are all stupid; I'm a great deal maker," whatever the political topic. This simplistic populist appeal is understandably scary to the GOP because it's working, even though there's no substantive message at all. The Donald can be ignorant about a lot of things, and he has demonstrated his ignorance time and again (the so-called "gotcha" questions), because people like you are satisfied that, whatever the issue, he's a great, successful dealmaker, notwithstanding bankruptcies, unethical behavior with lenders, incivility with opponents, and potential prejudices in his dealings with non-whites and women. You and millions of other angry white Americans see him as your Superman.

That's the picture.

No, but that's the picture you're being spoon fed by the media.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 1:13 am

Proton wrote:Projecting your delusions onto others is no way to go through life, son.

I know, and that's why I don't do it. You and apparently far too many people don't understand what racism or racist rhetoric actually is. In order for his comments to be racist, he would have to say they are rapists and killers because they're Mexican, i.e. Mexicans as a race are rapists and killers. Or he would have to somehow imply that all (or at least most) Mexicans are rapists and killers.

Of course, he never said or implied anything like this. You only heard that, because you want it to be true.

In fact, he has said the contrary, and only that a significant amount of those coming across are criminally inclined. He's even gone further and praised the Hispanic people as a whole, and even claims he'll win the Hispanic vote (which he may). He also claims he wants the good Mexicans to come to the US legally.

So I stand by my position that it is BS.

Auntie Lynn · Post by **Auntie Lynn** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 10:00 am

Looks to me like all the liberal bafflegab on this thread is only helping The Donald in the polls. Must be the impotent frenzy...

Have at it, guys...and tell dopey old Agnes that, in this election cycle, you have to be witty, clever, inventive, funny, swift, etc.

John F · Post by **John F** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 12:15 pm

This thread and the Corner Pub in general has zero effect on the polls - to suggest that is silly. And anyway, the only polls that matter are the actual primaries and elections; what we're seeing now is froth.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 1:47 pm

This is must see.

Trump openly answers a huge barrage of tough questions from the media:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMM41QstI2E

Now let's see Hillary go into to a barrage of questions like this. Just getting her to do one interview is like pulling teeth. A media free for all of questions -- no way. Again, the troops never notice glaring stuff like this.

Proton · Post by **Proton** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 4:52 pm

rwetmore wrote:
Proton wrote:Projecting your delusions onto others is no way to go through life, son.

rwetmore wrote:I know, and that's why I don't do it. You and apparently far too many people don't understand what racism or racist rhetoric actually is. In order for his comments to be racist, he would have to say they are rapists and killers because they're Mexican, i.e. Mexicans as a race are rapists and killers. Or he would have to somehow imply that all (or at least most) Mexicans are rapists and killers.
Merely stating that you are not doing something doesn’t necessarily make it so. Instead, you present yourself as a self-appointed "expert" on racism and rhetoric, at the same time dismissing out of hand anything anyone else has tried to point out to you. So, yes. You're doing it again.
rwetmore wrote:Of course, he never said or implied anything like this. You only heard that, because you want it to be true.
There you go again. You have no idea what I “want”, moreover, whatever I “want” has no bearing on the content (or lack thereof) of Trump’s speeches.

rwetmore wrote:In fact, he has said the contrary, and only that a significant amount of those coming across are criminally inclined. He's even gone further and praised the Hispanic people as a whole, and even claims he'll win the Hispanic vote (which he may). He also claims he wants the good Mexicans to come to the US legally.
Why, some of his best friends are……

Compliments on the rhetorical contortions you had to perform in order to rationalize some of Trump's utterances, the case-in-point being your insistence that the words "face" and "persona" are interchangeable. That didn't pass the giggle test.

rwetmore wrote:So I stand by my position that it is BS.

Just a suggestion, but you might consider cessation of all digging at some point.

Proton · Post by **Proton** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 4:53 pm

Auntie Lynn wrote:Looks to me like all the liberal bafflegab on this thread is only helping The Donald in the polls. Must be the impotent frenzy...

Have at it, guys...and tell dopey old Agnes that, in this election cycle, you have to be witty, clever, inventive, funny, swift, etc.

None of which attributes apply to you.

lennygoran · Post by **lennygoran** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 6:26 pm

Auntie Lynn wrote: Have at it, guys...and tell dopey old Agnes that, in this election cycle, you have to be witty, clever, inventive, funny, swift, etc.

The Trump of our forum strikes again-please, please, please-added to your dossier! Len

piston · Post by **piston** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 10:22 pm

The CNN debate tonight (if you know how to listen to knowledge, intelligence, and substance):
--Rubio, for his knowledge of foreign affairs and very articulate views in general;
--Fiorina, for her intelligence and very assertive, yet, most civil behavior;
--Carson, for his reassuring, even-handed, patriarchal tone;
--Bush, for his energy

and capable responses about his family, Trump, etc.

I think those were the four candidates who were most applauded in closing. Fiorina's closing statements were extremely inspiring.

As expected, Trump completely lacked in substance, bluffed his way out of his obvious ignorance, was not especially energetic, blatantly lied in Fiorina's and Bush's faces, and remained the same repetitive self. And, to be sure, Rand, with his one percent of supporters is far more knowledgeable and intelligent than Trump.

Chalkperson · Post by **Chalkperson** » Wed Sep 16, 2015 11:07 pm

rwetmore wrote:This is must see.

Trump openly answers a huge barrage of tough questions from the media:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMM41QstI2E

Now let's see Hillary go into to a barrage of questions like this. Just getting her to do one interview is like pulling teeth. A media free for all of questions -- no way. Again, the troops never notice glaring stuff like this.

This is a must see...

Yup, it sure is, you have a new obsession. Donald Trump, you are an intelligent man, Randall, what on earth are you doing obsessing over the most possibly the most embarrassing American shuckster alive.

Give me Pat Buchanan any day, he at least kind of knew what he was talking about.

You leave me speechless.

seriously...get a life.

This is my personal opinion. Nothing more.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 1:02 am

Chalkperson wrote:
rwetmore wrote:This is must see.

Trump openly answers a huge barrage of tough questions from the media:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMM41QstI2E

Now let's see Hillary go into to a barrage of questions like this. Just getting her to do one interview is like pulling teeth. A media free for all of questions -- no way. Again, the troops never notice glaring stuff like this.
This is a must see...

Yup, it sure is, you have a new obsession. Donald Trump, you are an intelligent man, Randall, what on earth are you doing obsessing over the most possibly the most embarrassing American shuckster alive.

Give me Pat Buchanan any day, he at least kind of knew what he was talking about.

You leave me speechless.

seriously...get a life.

This is my personal opinion. Nothing more.

With the world having gone completely mad in so many different ways, Trump brings some much needed fun and entertainment to the world of politics; and in some ways brings back some basic sanity to an utterly insane world. Is he ridiculous in a lot of ways? Yes, he is. Will his support fade? It may. If he somehow happens to win the nomination, I think I'm willing to take a chance and vote for him at this point. I don't think there is much hope for the world anyway, so I'm willing to take a chance on him for specific reasons I will lay out at some point -- should he win.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 1:08 am

In short, I'm having some fun with the Trump candidacy, and in particular, the reactions those who oppose and/or despise him -- both on the right and the left.

lennygoran · Post by **lennygoran** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 4:58 am

piston wrote:
As expected, Trump completely lacked in substance, bluffed his way out of his obvious ignorance, was not especially energetic, blatantly lied in Fiorina's and Bush's faces, and remained the same repetitive self. And, to be sure, Rand, with his one percent of supporters is far more knowledgeable and intelligent than Trump.

Agree with your assessment to a large extent but would have to add others who showed substance-the segments where Trump had to lay low obviously showing his lack of substance were a pleasure-Christie also did a fine job from his perspective imo--one who I felt didn't do as well was Carson. Regards, Len

lennygoran · Post by **lennygoran** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 5:05 am

rwetmore wrote: >With the world having gone completely mad in so many different ways, Trump brings some much needed fun and entertainment to the world of politics...I don't think there is much hope for the world anyway, so I'm willing to take a chance on him for specific reasons I will lay out at some point -- should he win.

There's plenty of entertainment around-don't you have Cable-plenty of entertainment--being President is serious business-you want to take chances-you're relatively close to Atlantic City-go take chances there-we have a world to navigate through! Regards, Len

John F · Post by **John F** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 6:25 am

Politics isn't about fun and entertainment. It's about the future of the nation and what we, the voters, choose to make of it. Trump has no vision of America's future, and most of the other Republicans do have visions which to me look disastrous. There's nothing to laugh about.

Auntie Lynn · Post by **Auntie Lynn** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 7:36 am

Anything going on here except this thread?? At this writing, there’s 292 posts and 2890
hits...

While we’re on the subject, Bernie is regarded by the Conventional Wisdom as a “cute and
cuddly” old poof who is unelectable.

Uncle Joe is out bawling and crying all over national TV, to what end no one seems to
know.

Wonder if Hillary can run the Oval Office from Dannemora...

If you guys want to talk only to each other, why not just e-mail...

lennygoran · Post by **lennygoran** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 7:51 am

Auntie Lynn wrote: If you guys want to talk only to each other, why not just e-mail...

We enjoy talking to each other in the forum-okay maybe not to you! BTW I know Carly Fiorina and you sure aren't her-while I disagree with her views she knows proper decorum. Regards, Len

piston · Post by **piston** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 8:05 am

John F wrote:Politics isn't about fun and entertainment. It's about the future of the nation and what we, the voters, choose to make of it. Trump has no vision of America's future, and most of the other Republicans do have visions which to me look disastrous. There's nothing to laugh about.

I think it takes Republican visions such as those expressed last night to make Democratic visions fiscally more responsible. The Dems are good at promising a lot, like Papa Claus and Mama Claus, in spite of a massive national debt that makes us vulnerable as a country (for God's sake, we are immensely in debt with autocratic and territorially aggressive China!!). If we are to go so deeply into debt, then let it be for military reasons, to keep us safe against terror and autocratic power. Can we afford to continue with skyrocketing social security costs if it's at the price of a weakening military in this day and age?

That national debate remains more urgent than ever and a presidential contest between H. Clinton and C. Fiorina (or Rubio) would give you and I a pretty clear indication of where the nation stands on the issue. What would be disastrous during the electoral campaign is to waste valuable time on Trump's populist rhetoric about massive deportations, vaccines and autism, and the like.

lennygoran · Post by **lennygoran** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 8:12 am

piston wrote: What would be disastrous during the electoral campaign is to waste valuable time on Trump's populist rhetoric about massive deportations, vaccines and autism, and the like.

Agree completely-I thought he was going to get away with nonsense yet again but by the second hour he had much less to say-it showed how ignorant of the details he actually is--what a fake he is-it's time the Republicans at least got behind a real candidate-not that blowhard bully! Regards, Len

John F · Post by **John F** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 10:04 am

piston, you're beginning to sound like a Republican.

I'm sorry, I don't see the national debt as the kind of hazard you do. Why not? Because the world has no other economy and no other currency to compare with ours; the loans America makes to others and ourselves are secure (not so the debt of states and smaller entities); such low risk to the borrowers means low risk that they will stop borrowing from us and look elsewhere. If, suddenly, everybody stopped borrowing and wanted to sit on cash, that would be dangerous. But as far as I can tell, it's never happened and never will.

Whether Carly Fiorino will try to make an issue of it, in the very unlikely chance that she is nominated, I've no idea, but I don't see that she would get much mileage out of it. The national debt is so low in the voters' priorities that it's never mentioned. And after all, the corporation she once ran, Hewlett-Packard, has and has always had a debt to equity ration of about 50-50. The "equity" of the United States is a great deal more than $18 trillion.

I also dispute that the U.S. should borrow mainly to finance defense. We spend far more on defense than we need to in the post-cold-war world - 54% of our total discretionary spending. Ever since 1980 we have spent more discretionary $$$ on defense than on everything else combined. Our enemies are no longer great nation-states with massive resources, whom we now greatly outspend anyway - three times as many $$$ as China, six times as many as Russia. They are small, low-budget, fanatically motivated, non-national bands of trouble-makers. Building more stealth bombers and aircraft carriers does nothing to make us safer from our real enemies.

What we need to spend our treasure on is not stuff that we blow up but investments that last and make us economically stronger, ranging from the roads and bridges we depend on to the health of our people, who should be our greatest resource. The Republicans have done everything they can to block these kinds of spending, and they would cut even more if given the chance. It's not liberal, it's not ideological, it's just intelligent to oppose this kind of self-defeat.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 11:40 am

BTW, kudos to CNN who did an excellent and totally professional job with the debate. I hear it was the highest rated event the network has ever done. No 'gotcha' or unfair questions, and all the candidates were treated fairly and equally respected. That is the way it should be done.

rwetmore · Post by **rwetmore** » Thu Sep 17, 2015 12:22 pm

John F wrote:Politics isn't about fun and entertainment. It's about the future of the nation and what we, the voters, choose to make of it.

I know what you're saying, but it can be both.

John F wrote:Trump has no vision of America's future, and most of the other Republicans do have visions which to me look disastrous. There's nothing to laugh about.

Of course Trump has a vision of America's Future. If you can't see that then you're deluding yourself like a lot of people seem to be doing regarding him.

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