One of the PARIS TERRORISTS may have been a Syrian Migrant..

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Chalkperson
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Chalkperson » Tue Nov 17, 2015 12:27 pm

Steve Jobs biological father was a Syrian immigrant..

Shove that in your Repblican pipe and smoke it Randall.

Your mob sicken me to my stomach.
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rwetmore
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Tue Nov 17, 2015 1:41 pm

Here is some more information on the lead attacker if anyone's interested:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... tches.html
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

absinthe
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by absinthe » Tue Nov 17, 2015 2:40 pm

Chalkperson wrote:
rwetmore wrote:This is why we should not take any of these people into this country:

http://news.yahoo.com/two-men-linked-pa ... 55102.html

Obama wants to take in a few hundred thousand Syrian refugees. And Trump is lambasted for frequently saying 'our leaders are stupid', and yet us Trump supporters are supposed to be the fools?
I never realized how incredibly stupid you were until I read this Thread. Now I know.

Take your racism elsewhere, and join your idol Trump in the Buffoon cage at the zoo.

You deserve each other.
Why d'you call it racism? Most of the prejudice I encounter is anti-Islam and considering the infiltration among refugees, I'm not surprised. It is the most appalling religion - reduces women to chattels, denies them education, jobs and they have to wear those ridiculous grim-reaper outfits because Muslim men can't control their urges. A Muslim's brace of wives has to walk to his rear. So if being anti-oppressive-religious-governance or anti-oppressive-theocracies, is racist, so be it - I'm racist.But it simply isn't racism.

What you, America, anywhere, must remember is that only a small portion are Syrian. The rest are posing as Syrian. Caution is justified. One has to read beyond the controlled media to understand why and what's really going on in Europe on the streets.

Have a look at the youtube video With Open Gates.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44vzMNG2fZc

absinthe
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by absinthe » Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:06 pm

rwetmore wrote:This is why we should not take any of these people into this country:

http://news.yahoo.com/two-men-linked-pa ... 55102.html

Obama wants to take in a few hundred thousand Syrian refugees. And Trump is lambasted for frequently saying 'our leaders are stupid', and yet us Trump supporters are supposed to be the fools?
Certainly caution is necessary - not only because not every Syrian refugee is just that but ISIL infiltrators are among them. Various reports and guestimates have emerged, one claiming that 2% are infiltrators. Even if that's miles out and only half a percent are jihadis, for 100,000, you'd be taking in 500 bad boys.

This has been explained to Mad Merkel who even now persists with her "welcome all" agenda. To think that of 1 million migrants taken in unchecked (they're no longer refugees by the time they reach the land of milk and honey) there are zero jihadists is plain crazy. Even at 0.5%, she will have taken in an army of 5,000. She has one thing in common with Hitler - mad. She won't listen to advice and remains wilfully blind to what she's brought into Germany.

John F
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:08 pm

Syrian Passport by Stadium Stolen or Fake, A.F.P. Reports

A Syrian passport found near the body of one of the suicide bombers outside the Stade de France after the attacks on Friday may not be a useful clue to the bomber’s identity.

Agence France-Presse is reporting, citing a source close to the investigation, that the passport bore the name of Ahmad al-Mohammad, a soldier in the Syrian Army who was born in 1990 and died months ago. French investigators say all indications point towards the fact he was a soldier loyal to Syrian President Bashar al-Assad. The source, who spoke on condition of anonymity to A.F.P., said the passport was either taken or fabricated based on a real identity.

Someone showed either the same passport or a copy of it to register as a refugee on the Greek island of Leros on Oct. 3, and the same thing happened in Serbia and Croatia in the following days. Thomas de Maiziere, the German interior minister, said that that would be unusual for a bona fide migrant, and he suggested on Tuesday that the passport found at the bombing scene might be a “false trail” placed deliberately by the Islamic State attackers to turn public opinion against Syrian refugees.

http://www.nytimes.com/live/paris-attac ... icle-embed

As I suggested.
John Francis

rwetmore
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:18 pm

I saw a blog post today by someone (who I don't know) that really struck me. Is he really wrong?

"A little history.

My oldest son, Kent, graduated from RIP on September 12, 2001. RIP, is the first phase of becoming a Ranger with United States Army. Shortly there after he was deployed with some of the first Army Rangers into Afghanistan.

Since all the sudden my son was in war I decided I needed to find out what the heck we were fighting. So I read the Koran, the Hadith and several books by Robert Spencer and Steve Emerson. I do not consider myself an expert on Islam but I have more foundation than the majority of Americans and over 95% of our elected officials.

Whenever you're in a fight you certainly need to understand and know your enemy. The west has not come to this point yet I have. Our enemy is Islam. The Koran dictates that Muslims must kill the infidel or nonbelievers. If a Muslim refutes this command he becomes an apostate. The penalty for an apostate is death. That is the primary reason you don't hear Muslims stand up and condemn violent episodes such as what just happened in Paris. It is also why you seldom hear condemnation from Imans that are associated with mosques anywhere in the west including United States.

It becomes very difficult for someone like me to speak out. Political correctness abounds and we are quickly condemned as his llama fold abounds and we are quickly condemned as Islamophobes. Those that do take that position of political correctness are weak, uneducated fools that put our nation and people at risk over admitting reality is knocking at your door.

It's very difficult for someone like myself, that is handicap, cannot type and must use dictation products to voice an opinion. I only say this because it is not easy to voice an opinion that is based on more education than most Americans will endure.

Thank you so much for putting up with my diatribe."
Last edited by rwetmore on Tue Nov 17, 2015 6:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

Proton
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Proton » Tue Nov 17, 2015 5:56 pm

rwetmore wrote:I saw a blot post today by someone (who I don't know) that really struck me. Is he really wrong?

(snip)

... That is the primary reason you don't hear Muslims stand up and condemn violent episodes such as what just happened in Paris. It is also why you seldom hear condemnation from Imans that are associated with mosques anywhere in the west including United States.
Once again, you're mistaken.
A simple Google search "Muslims condemn Paris attacks"
yielded about 17,700,000 results in 380ms.


"A lie can run around the world before the truth can get its boots on."
James Watt

“No government has the right to decide on the truth of scientific principles, nor to prescribe in any way the character of the questions investigated."
Richard Feynman
The Quantum Universe has a quotation from me in every chapter — but it's a damn good book anyway.”
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rwetmore
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Tue Nov 17, 2015 6:07 pm

Proton wrote:
rwetmore wrote:I saw a blot post today by someone (who I don't know) that really struck me. Is he really wrong?

(snip)

... That is the primary reason you don't hear Muslims stand up and condemn violent episodes such as what just happened in Paris. It is also why you seldom hear condemnation from Imans that are associated with mosques anywhere in the west including United States.
Once again, you're mistaken.
A simple Google search "Muslims condemn Paris attacks"
yielded about 17,700,000 results in 380ms.
I agree we are not entirely at war with Islam, but we are at war with radical Islam. We have many politicians in power, include Obama, who won't even acknowledge we are at war with radical Islam. If we can't be honest and candid with ourselves and everyone else as to what we're at war with, how can we ever expect to win and defeat this enemy? I say we can't and never will. And even if we can acknowledge it, political correctness is an enormous obstacle blocking the way.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

Proton
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Proton » Tue Nov 17, 2015 6:35 pm

rwetmore wrote:
Proton wrote:
rwetmore wrote:I saw a blot post today by someone (who I don't know) that really struck me. Is he really wrong?

(snip)

... That is the primary reason you don't hear Muslims stand up and condemn violent episodes such as what just happened in Paris. It is also why you seldom hear condemnation from Imans that are associated with mosques anywhere in the west including United States.
Once again, you're mistaken.
A simple Google search "Muslims condemn Paris attacks"
yielded about 17,700,000 results in 380ms.
I agree we not entirely at war with Islam, but we are at war with radical Islam. We have many politicians in power, include Obama, who won't even acknowledge we are at war with radical Islam. If we can't be honest and candid with ourselves and everyone else as to what we're at war with, how can we ever expect to win and defeat this enemy? I say we can't and never will. And even if we can acknowledge it, political correctness is an enormous obstacle blocking the way.
Daesh (I refer to them as such because they really detest that name) is not Islam any more than the KKK is Christianity.
Just yesterday, President Obama referred to Daesh as "the face of evil." Not good enough, unless they are the magic words "Radical Islam"?? Does that imply that those killed in US and French airstrikes on Daesh were not radical jihadists?

You folks are always decrying "political correctness", while at the same time trying to impose it on President Obama. Ah, the irony! :lol:


"A lie can run around the world before the truth can get its boots on."
James Watt

“No government has the right to decide on the truth of scientific principles, nor to prescribe in any way the character of the questions investigated."
Richard Feynman
The Quantum Universe has a quotation from me in every chapter — but it's a damn good book anyway.”
Richard Feynman



rwetmore
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:31 pm

Here is a provocative piece:

Obama’s ‘patience’ merely gave ISIS time to grow
By Ralph Peters

http://nypost.com/2015/11/16/obamas-pat ... e-to-grow/
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Chalkperson » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:46 pm

It appears that none of the Terrorists were actually from Syria, they were all European Nationals.

This seems to be the main Thread on the horrors of last Friday.

Would Randall care to think of a better Thread title?

One that is factual?

Like 'Paris Terrorist Attacks.'

Go to the opening post, click edit, rename the Thread.
Sent via Twitter by @chalkperson

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Tue Nov 17, 2015 11:19 pm

rwetmore wrote:we are at war with radical Islam. We have many politicians in power, include Obama, who won't even acknowledge we are at war with radical Islam.
That is not true. "Radical Islam," a blurred and indiscriminate term, is not the entity we are at war with; it's not an entity at all. We are at war with the terrorist organization Al Qaeda and the self-styled Islamic State. We are not at war with Iran, a radical Islamic state by any standards, nor with other groups and movements in Saudi Arabia and elsewhere who have not attacked us or our allies.

This is not political correctness. It is correctness, period. And your generalization is not politically incorrect, it is incorrect, period. Loose, cheap talk like that confuses the issue and gives a kind of specious legitimacy to anti-Islamic prejudice. Let's fight our real enemies, not shadows. That's what our President is doing, or trying to do.
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by absinthe » Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:22 am

Chalkperson wrote:It appears that none of the Terrorists were actually from Syria, they were all European Nationals.

This seems to be the main Thread on the horrors of last Friday.

Would Randall care to think of a better Thread title?

One that is factual?

Like 'Paris Terrorist Attacks.'

Go to the opening post, click edit, rename the Thread.
Chalkie, they may be European Nationals, some born in Europe, some nationalised from ME States but there's a traffic of recruits and training from Europe.

Add Molenbeek (Belgium) to the list of recruitment centres. I thought it was just Malmo, Gothenburg and a few towns in the UK but it's far wider spread even leaving out places like Tunisia. These aren't just random ones and twos who for whatever reason want to join the fray but platoons of people. There's Mad Merkel with her overladen camps that are hotbeds for radicalisation.

As for "Syrian refugees", the Mad Mama's ineptitude is coming to light.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/620 ... -Keith-Vaz

rwetmore
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:27 am

John F wrote:
rwetmore wrote:we are at war with radical Islam. We have many politicians in power, include Obama, who won't even acknowledge we are at war with radical Islam.
That is not true. "Radical Islam," a blurred and indiscriminate term, is not the entity we are at war with; it's not an entity at all. We are at war with the terrorist organization Al Qaeda and the self-styled Islamic State.
Whose entire underlying foundation, motivation, and justification is the Islam religion. You can play semantic games all day, but it's just not true, IMO.
John F wrote:We are not at war with Iran, a radical Islamic state by any standards, nor with other groups and movements in Saudi Arabia and elsewhere who have not attacked us or our allies.
We are effectively at war with Iran, but right now it's a cold war. We are just not actually in a hot war with Iran at the moment.
John F wrote:This is not political correctness. It is correctness, period. And your generalization is not politically incorrect, it is incorrect, period. Loose, cheap talk like that confuses the issue and gives a kind of specious legitimacy to anti-Islamic prejudice. Let's fight our real enemies, not shadows.
Again, this is more semantics. To say we are at war with radical Islam is not politically correct, for if it were, liberals such as yourself would readily use the term.
John F wrote:That's what our President is doing, or trying to do.
What specifically is he doing to fight this enemy? I'm not saying I have all the answers, but Obama doesn't seem to be doing much. He seems more concerned about global warming and establishing his legacy, and this is just a big annoyance getting in the way of those things.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by lennygoran » Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:19 am

rwetmore wrote:
What specifically is he doing to fight this enemy? I'm not saying I have all the answers, but Obama doesn't seem to be doing much. He seems more concerned about global warming and establishing his legacy, and this is just a big annoyance getting in the way of those things.
Very important-he has kept boots off the ground for the most part-it's so complicated and with your loose tongue I'm afraid you'll never get it. Regards, Len :(

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by karlhenning » Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:48 am

Chalkperson wrote:It appears that none of the Terrorists were actually from Syria, they were all European Nationals.

This seems to be the main Thread on the horrors of last Friday.

Would Randall care to think of a better Thread title?

One that is factual?

Like 'Paris Terrorist Attacks.'

Go to the opening post, click edit, rename the Thread.
Why, when (like El Tupé) he's all about the xenophobic fearmongering? ; )
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by karlhenning » Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:49 am

John F wrote:That is not true. "Radical Islam," a blurred and indiscriminate term . . .
. . . favored by those who want to make it a "Christian" battle.

Cheers,
~k.
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:11 am

lennygoran wrote:
rwetmore wrote:What specifically is he doing to fight this enemy? I'm not saying I have all the answers, but Obama doesn't seem to be doing much. He seems more concerned about global warming and establishing his legacy, and this is just a big annoyance getting in the way of those things.
Very important-he has kept boots off the ground for the most part-it's so complicated and with your loose tongue I'm afraid you'll never get it. Regards, Len :(
If you haven't noticed, rwetmore, Ameican combat forces have been involved in Syria for quite a while, chiefly in the air. It began with support for the rebels against the murderous dictatorial regime of Bashar Al-Assad, and replacing that regime with one that's legitimate remains a chief American war aim. Later, when ISIS entered the conflict against both Al-Assad and the rebels against him, the U.S. began a bombing campaign against ISIS, and has continued it for nearly a year with more than 8,000 strikes in Syria and Iraq, while also continuing to provide aid to the rebels. Defeating ISIS, then, is our second war aim, and the administration believes it can't be achieved until Al-Assad has been removed, our first war aim. Some now say it's time to set aside one of those and focus exclusively on the other, and maybe so; see my next post below. But it's not true that we, or specifically President Obama as you say, haven't been "doing much" to fight "the enemy." To the contrary, we've been fighting two enemies.

What more do you want the U.S. to do? Send in a hundred thousand troops to fight ISIS on the ground? After the Iraq debacle, the American public won't stand for it, unless ISIS succeeds in a major terrorist attack in Washington D.C. But then what? And what, actually, is needed? ISIS has been losing ground recently, and if Russia does as it says and focuses its own war in Syria against ISIS rather than in support of Al-Assad, what difference will some more American bombing sorties make?
Last edited by John F on Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:50 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:29 am

Heavy Gunfire Erupts as French Police Seek Suspects in Raid
By AURELIEN BREEDEN, LIZ ALDERMAN and KATRIN BENNHOLD
NOV. 17, 2015

PARIS — The police stormed the northern Paris suburb of St.-Denis before dawn Wednesday morning in a raid aimed at capturing at least two fugitives suspected in the terrorist attacks that killed 129 people in Paris on Friday. A woman who was holed up in the apartment activated a suicide vest at the beginning of the raid and has died, according to the Paris prosecutor’s office. Three men who were in the apartment were “extracted” by police forces and have been arrested. Their identities are not known at this time.

The prosecutor’s office said the target of the raids was Abdelhamid Abaaoud, the Belgian militant suspected of organizing the attacks, but there was no confirmation of whether Mr. Abaaoud was in the apartment at the time of the raid.

The raid began around 4 a.m. when heavy gunfire erupted, the suburb’s mayor, Didier Paillard, and residents told a French television channel, iTélé, and it lasted at least 20 minutes. Helicopters flew overhead, and the authorities warned people to stay indoors. “It was really like guerrilla warfare,” a resident named Pierre-Eric told BFM TV.

The raid appeared to focus on an apartment near Place Jean Jaurès, a main square in St.-Denis not far from the Stade de France, where three of the seven attackers who died on Friday blew themselves up. The Paris prosecutor’s office confirmed the raid but could not provide immediate details, except that an unspecified number of men, holed up in an apartment, were being targeted. “Security instructions: do not go out onto the street in this area,” St. Denis officials said on Twitter, adding that the Rue de la République, the Rue Cornillon and the Rue Chaumettes had been cordoned off. A second round of gunfire and explosions was reported just before 7:30 a.m.

Prime Minister Manuel Valls and Interior Minister Bernard Cazeneuve joined President François Hollande at the Élysée Palace on Wednesday morning to monitor the operation.

At least two fugitives are at large: one whose existence was confirmed by intelligence officials on Tuesday night, and Salah Abdeslam, 26, a Frenchman who was believed to have escaped to Brussels. In addition to the two fugitives, the authorities were seeking Mr. Abaaoud, a Belgian militant suspected of organizing the attacks. On Tuesday, French and American intelligence officials said they believed that Mr. Abaaoud was in Syria with fellow Islamic State militants, but on Wednesday morning, several TV stations, citing unnamed police sources, said that Mr. Abaaoud might be one of the men holed up in St.-Denis...

Early Tuesday, 10 French fighter jets, taking off from bases in Jordan and the Persian Gulf, dropped 16 bombs on what the French Defense Ministry described as an Islamic State command center and training center in the group’s self-proclaimed capital of Raqqa, Syria. Hours later, Russia carried out an attack on Raqqa with cruise missiles and long-range bombers, after acknowledging that a terrorist bomb brought down a Russian jetliner over the Sinai Peninsula in Egypt — a hotbed of Islamic State activity — on Oct. 31.

France, through its defense minister, Jean-Yves Le Drian, took the extraordinary step on Tuesday of invoking a European Union treaty that obliges members to help any member that is “the victim of armed aggression on its territory.”

Mr. Hollande took steps to shore up global support for what he has called a war to annihilate the Islamic State, also known as ISIS or ISIL. He met with Secretary of State John Kerry, who expressed sympathy but reiterated the Obama administration’s view that the group would not be destroyed until Syria’s embattled president, Bashar al-Assad, leaves power...

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/18/world ... tacks.html
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by lennygoran » Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:34 am

Just a few minutes ago CNN was saying they got to those apartments just in time to stop an attack as large as the one on Fri. Regards, Len

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:42 am

Envisioning How Global Powers Can Smash ISIS
By TIM ARANGO
NOV. 17, 2015

Much of the world agrees that the Islamic State needs to be crushed. But how that can be accomplished, and what the unintended consequences may be, are a lot more complicated.

The group, also known as ISIS, ISIL and Daesh, has proved to be as flexible and amoebalike as it is apocalyptic and brutal. It thrives under pressure, and a stepped-up war by the West may be just what it wants, to draw new recruits.

And don’t forget that the group’s predecessor was defeated once before: Al Qaeda in Mesopotamia, established to fight the Americans after the invasion of Iraq in 2003, was gutted and its leaders killed by 2009. That took thousands of American lives, many billions of dollars and an ultimately unsustainable effort to pay Sunni tribal leaders to fight against the group. But after the Americans left Iraq, the group rose again from the shadows, and in its reincarnation became even more brutal and determined.

Now that an array of regional and world powers, including rivals like Russia and the United States, Saudi Arabia and Iran, agree that the group must be crushed, the question is how to avoid a repeat of past failures.

Talking to a diverse group of experts, officials, religious scholars and former jihadis makes clear there is no consensus on a simple strategy to defeat the Islamic State. But there are some themes — like the need to take a decisive role in the Syrian conflict and to push a broader reformation of Islam — that a range of people who follow the group say must be part of a solution.

ISIS or Assad?

In August 2011, as the Syrian government increased its use of force to crush a popular uprising, President Obama called for President Bashar al-Assad to go. “For the sake of the Syrian people, the time has come for President Assad to step aside,” he said. Since then, a lot has changed, but not Mr. Obama’s position. Even today, while willing to tolerate Mr. Assad in power for a brief transition, the United States has tried to battle the Islamic State inside Syria without appearing to bolster Mr. Assad.

The Russians, however, insist that the focus should be on defeating the Islamic State, and that Mr. Assad is an ally in that battle.

Experts say the United States’ position — beating the Islamic State and ousting Mr. Assad — has been largely ineffective on both counts. Now, they say, it is time for the United States to abandon the dual focus and take a stand.

One option is for the United States to align with Russia, Iran and the Syrian government, establishing an alliance to carry out an intensified war against the group. “You cannot play two cards at once,” said Kirill V. Kabanov, a Russian security expert and a former domestic intelligence agent, describing what he sees as the flawed Western approach of trying to defeat both Mr. Assad and the Islamic State. He said the solution was choosing the lesser evil — Mr. Assad, in his view — in the Syrian civil war.

The other option is for the United States to prioritize the removal of Mr. Assad, whose military has been responsible for far more carnage in Syria than the Islamic State. As long as Mr. Assad is in power, it will be difficult to get many Sunni rebels to help in the fight against the group. “There is probably no solution to ISIS until there is a solution to Assad,” said J. M. Berger, a scholar at the Brookings Institution and a co-author of the book “ISIS: The State of Terror.” “That is the factor that paralyzes everything else.”

Emile Hokayem, a senior fellow at the International Institute for Strategic Studies, argued that Western powers needed to start identifying Mr. Assad’s government as part of the problem, because its brutality and sectarianism have allowed the Islamic State to thrive. “Assad is not a sideshow,” he said. “He is at the center of this massive dilemma.”

If the United States went this route, it would immediately have the support of Saudi Arabia and Turkey, but it would require a great deal of diplomatic heavy-lifting to persuade Mr. Assad’s two most important backers — the Russians and the Iranians — to agree to his removal.

“The answer is simple: To beat ISIS, you need the enlistment of the Sunni forces that won’t happen as long as Assad remains in power in Damascus,” said Ehud Yaari, an Israel-based fellow at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy. “The shortest and most effective way to deal with ISIS is for the United States and Russia to come to an agreement about the removal of Assad, and they will get support from others. Then the Sunni forces, the rebels, can deal with ISIS on the ground.”..

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/18/world ... -isis.html
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Wed Nov 18, 2015 1:37 pm

lennygoran wrote:Just a few minutes ago CNN was saying they got to those apartments just in time to stop an attack as large as the one on Fri. Regards, Len
Here's more:

Police Raid: 2 Killed and 7 Arrested
By LILIA BLAISE, LIZ ALDERMAN and AURELIEN BREEDEN
NOV. 18, 2015

ST.-DENIS, France — Heavy gunfire and explosions rocked the northern Paris suburb of St.-Denis on Wednesday as the French police raided an apartment building, looking for the Belgian militant suspected of orchestrating the Paris terrorist attacks.

A young woman in the apartment died when she set off an explosive vest, while a man died from gunfire and the detonation of a grenade, the authorities said. But it was not clear if the police found the man they were looking for: Abdelhamid Abaaoud, an Islamic State fighter with a long history of terrorist activity, whose own family wished for his death.

The raid began around 4:15 a.m. Paris time, when special police forces, backed by truckloads of soldiers, cordoned off an area near the Place Jean Jaurès, a main square in the medieval heart of St.-Denis — not far from the Stade de France, the stadium where three attackers blew themselves up on Friday, and a Gothic basilica where many French monarchs are buried.

At least five people were inside the apartment, on the third floor of a dingy building on the Rue du Corbillon. Along with the woman and man who died, three other people were in the apartment. They were arrested, along with two people found “hiding in the rubble,” and two others outside the apartment building...

Paris Prosecutor Describes Morning St.-Denis Raid

At a news conference Wednesday, the prosecutor, François Molins, said the authorities had neutralized ”a new team of terrorists” that was ready to act. Mr. Molins said the police who stormed an apartment in St.-Denis, just outside Paris, early Wednesday morning faced fierce resistance. At least two suspects died, the authorities said. Eight were arrested.

The target of the raid was Abdelhamid Abaaoud, but Mr. Molins would say only that he was not in custody. He declined to go into detail about those who were killed or injured in the raid. He also did not identify the people arrested.

Mr. Molins said the police were still searching for another person linked with Friday’s attack, Salah Abdeslam. Mr. Abdeslam, who the authorities say rented a car that was used to transport some of the gunmen in the Paris rampage, served time in prison in Brussels at the same time as Mr. Abaaoud.

When police officers stormed the third-floor apartment where they believed Mr. Abaaoud was hiding out early Wednesday, there was a shootout that lasted more than an hour. During the course of the fierce gun battle, he said, there was an explosion, which the police believe was caused by a woman detonating a suicide vest. She was killed. At least one unidentified man was killed during the operation.

The building is near collapse, Mr. Molins said. “It is extremely delicate and difficult working in this building,” he said.

Mr. Molins outlined in detail the “arsenal of war weapons” that were used in Friday’s attacks. He also confirmed reports that a mobile phone had been recovered in a trash can outside the Bataclan concert hall that offered valuable insight for investigators. Five of the seven terrorists involved in Friday’s attacks have been identified, he said, but two remain unidentified.

http://www.nytimes.com/live/paris-attac ... rning-raid
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Auntie Lynn » Wed Nov 18, 2015 2:56 pm

News feeds now reporting five Syrians detained in Honduras airport on fake Greek
passports heading for the good old USofA (heading, no doubt, for all those northeastern liberals).

Also - “we got him” - apparently this morning’s Paris raid got everybody’s great good buddy,
Abdelhamid. Now, I will save our over-worked friend, rwetmore, the trouble of explaining this
to you. Today’s bouncing baby Muslim is tomorrow’s masked terrorist carrying an AK-47 and
coming after YOU - you have been warned.

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:59 pm

Unknown people traveling on false passports are, duh, unidentified and their nationalities and possible purposes are therefore unknown. A spokesman for the Honduran police said, "We suppose that they were going to illegally travel by land all the way to the United States." "We suppose" means "We don't know but we're guessing anyway." Loose talk like that, and like yours, does no good, and only feeds irresponsible hatred. The CNN story I'm quoting from concludes, "None of the detentions have been tied to terrorism. Many migrants with no ties to terrorism travel on false documents around the world."

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/18/americas/ ... index.html
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by RebLem » Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:24 pm

If we are going to close our doors to Syrian refugees, we should also pack up the Statue of Liberty and send it back to France with the message that we no longer deserve it and they do.
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Chalkperson » Thu Nov 19, 2015 12:28 am

rwetmore wrote: What specifically is he doing to fight this enemy? I'm not saying I have all the answers, but Obama doesn't seem to be doing much. He seems more concerned about global warming and establishing his legacy, and this is just a big annoyance getting in the way of those things.
OK Randall, instead of posting links from such illustrious (news) papers such as the Daily Fail, and the NY Daily News, Please tell us what solution or solutions you have in mind.

I'm genuinely very interested in what YOU would do to stop ISIS, if you were in the White House.
Sent via Twitter by @chalkperson

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Thu Nov 19, 2015 11:58 am

Paris Attack’s Top Suspect, Abdelhamid Abaaoud, Died in Raid, France Says
By AURELIEN BREEDEN and KIMIKO DE FREYTAS-TAMURA
NOV. 19, 2015

PARIS — Abdelhamid Abaaoud, the Islamic State militant suspected of orchestrating the Paris terrorist attacks, died in a police raid in the northern Paris suburb of St.-Denis early Wednesday, the French authorities announced on Thursday. The confirmation of Mr. Abaaoud’s death followed fingerprint analysis, the Paris prosecutor, François Molins, said in a statement. Mr. Abaaoud’s body was heavily riddled with wounds from gunfire and a grenade detonated during the raid. “We do not know at this stage whether Abaaoud blew himself up or not,” Mr. Molins’s office said.

At least one other person died in the raid: a woman who detonated a suicide vest, whom two French intelligence officials have identified as Hasna Aitboulahcen, 26, a cousin of Mr. Abaaoud.

Mr. Abaaoud’s death ended one chapter of the intense criminal investigation that began on Friday night, after three teams of terrorists, in a series of closely coordinated attacks, killed 129 people. But a manhunt continued in Belgium for Salah Abdeslam, 26, a French citizen who is thought to have fled to Brussels after taking part in the attacks. On Thursday, the Belgian authorities arrested nine people — seven of them as part of an investigation into Bilal Hadfi, 20, who detonated his explosive vest outside the Stade de France on Friday — in a series of raids. Homes were searched in the neighborhoods of Laeken, Uccle, Jette and Molenbeek. Molenbeek was the base of Mr. Abdeslam; his brother Ibrahim, who was one of the seven attackers who died; and Mr. Abaaoud.

French intelligence officials have concluded that Mr. Abaaoud was involved in at least four of six terrorist plots in France that have been foiled since the spring, Interior Minister Bernard Cazeneuve announced at a news conference.

Mr. Abaaoud, a Belgian citizen who was 27 or 28, went to Syria last year to fight with the Islamic State, but it was not until Monday that French authorities learned — through a foreign intelligence service — that he might be back in Europe, Mr. Cazeneuve said...

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/20/world ... tacks.html


An ISIS Militant From Belgium Whose Own Family Wanted Him Dead
By ANDREW HIGGINS and KIMIKO DE FREYTAS-TAMURA
NOV. 17, 2015

BRUSSELS — When the family of Abdelhamid Abaaoud received word from Syria last fall that he had been killed fighting for the Islamic State, it rejoiced at what it took to be excellent news about a wayward son it had come to despise. “We are praying that Abdelhamid really is dead,” his older sister, Yasmina, said at the time.

The family’s prayers — and the hopes of Western security officials — were not answered. Mr. Abaaoud, then 26, was in reality on his way back to Europe to meet secretly with Islamic extremists who shared his determination to spread mayhem. He has since been linked to a string of terrorist operations that culminated with Friday’s attacks in Paris.

“Of course, it is not joyous to make blood flow. But, from time to time, it is pleasant to see the blood of disbelievers,” Mr. Abaaoud declared in a French-language recruiting video for the Islamic State released shortly before his supposed death...

Like many of the jihadists who have carried out attacks in Europe, including the brothers who attacked the French satirical magazine Charlie Hebdo in January, Mr. Abaaoud showed far more interest in thievery and drugs when he was a young man than in Islam, particularly the highly disciplined, self-sacrificing Salafi strain favored by many militants.

Nor was his family impoverished. His father, Omar, owned a clothing store off the market square in Molenbeek, a borough of Brussels, and the family lived nearby in a spacious if shabby corner home on Rue de l’Avenir — Future Street — near the local police station.

Despite his subsequent denunciations of the mistreatment suffered by Muslims in Europe, he enjoyed privileges available to few immigrants, including admission to an exclusive Catholic school, Collège Saint-Pierre d’Uccle, in an upscale residential district of Brussels. He was given a place as a first-year student in the secondary school but stayed only one year. An assistant to Saint-Pierre’s director, who declined to give her name, said he had apparently flunked out. Others say he was dismissed for poor behavior.

He then drifted into a group of friends in Molenbeek who engaged in various petty crimes. Among his friends were Ibrahim and Salah Abdeslam, two brothers who, like Mr. Abaaoud, lived just a few blocks away and are now at the center of the investigation into the Paris attacks. Ibrahim Abdeslam was one of the suicide bombers on Friday, and Salah Abdeslam, who rented a car in Brussels that was used to transport some of the gunmen in the attacks on Paris, is the target of an extensive manhunt.

Mr. Abaaoud was arrested for petty crime in 2010 and spent time in the same prison in Brussels where Ibrahim Abdeslam was being held, according to the spokesman for Belgium’s federal prosecutor and Ibrahim’s former lawyer. It is not known if they were in touch while in the prison, but they did not stay long. After their release, they returned to Molenbeek, often hanging out at a dingy bar known as a hangout for drug dealers.

To the dismay of his family, which had not seen him show any religious zeal, Mr. Abaaoud suddenly moved to Syria in the beginning of 2014, according to jihadi experts tracking Belgian militants. Soon after his arrival in Syria, where he stayed for a time in a grand villa in Aleppo used to house French-speaking jihadists, he explained his choice in a video: “All my life I have seen the blood of Muslims flow. I pray that God breaks the backs of those who oppose him” and “that he exterminates them,” he said...

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/18/world ... -dead.html
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Seán » Thu Nov 19, 2015 1:57 pm

"PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants..."

Never let facts get in the way when the you have an axe to grind, eh?
Seán

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Chalkperson » Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:31 pm

Seán wrote:"PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants..."

Never let facts get in the way when the you have an axe to grind, eh?
I asked Randall to change this misleading title, he refused.

so, on your behalf I will ask again.

Dear Randall,

Please open your original post, click Edit Post, then create factual title.

This is because your Thread has become the main one for News, its not a good idea to mislead the lurkers.

Thx
Sent via Twitter by @chalkperson

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by karlhenning » Thu Nov 19, 2015 3:12 pm

Some people are impervious to facts. Perhaps that is a factor, in being a big fan of El Tupé, eh?

Cheers,
~k.
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Composer & Clarinetist
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by jbuck919 » Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:08 pm

Chalkperson wrote:
Seán wrote:"PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants..."

Never let facts get in the way when the you have an axe to grind, eh?
I asked Randall to change this misleading title, he refused.

so, on your behalf I will ask again.

Dear Randall,

Please open your original post, click Edit Post, then create factual title.

This is because your Thread has become the main one for News, its not a good idea to mislead the lurkers.

Thx
Chalkie is calling attention to an aspect of this board that is often forgotten or neglected, which is that we have a lot of lurkers. (Don't ask how I know this--I just do.) It is partly for that reason that our members within the normal range of the political spectrum, including myself, made a point of keeping up the dialogue in earlier years when Randall's notions would have seemed mild in comparison to other extremist or misinformed views. Speaking now only for myself, I couldn't be a member of a board where lovers of classical music and potential members might come and find that kind of nonsense unchallenged.

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:12 pm

Chalkperson wrote:
Seán wrote:"PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants..."

Never let facts get in the way when the you have an axe to grind, eh?
I asked Randall to change this misleading title, he refused.

so, on your behalf I will ask again.

Dear Randall,

Please open your original post, click Edit Post, then create factual title.

This is because your Thread has become the main one for News, its not a good idea to mislead the lurkers.

Thx
Where has it been officially established that none of the attackers appear to have entered Europe via the Syrian migration crisis? Doesn't it still appear that one of them did? Wasn't there a passport linked to one of them that entered in Greece? Whose fingerprints match those on the passport, or has this all been officially retracted now? If it has, I'll change the title.

That aside, one would have to be blind and foolish beyond belief to not the see the golden opportunity ISIS has to use the migrant crisis to further infiltrate the West with their members in significant numbers. I mean they would be just unbelievably stupid not to do it, as it's so ridiculously easy to do since there is no way to identity them among the real refugees. They would not even be a remotely formidable enemy if they don't do this. I mean like duh and then some. Am I in the twilight zone here...is this real or am I dreaming?

It's things like this that have caused me to no longer have any faith in humanity. If we let them, they are nearly certainly going to use the migration crisis to infiltrate and conduct attacks. Not withstanding that even without the migrant crisis, they still could succeed in infiltrating and conducting attacks, but likely not in as many numbers. Of course, it's possible the attacks will be foiled, and we certainly hope they are, but when so many people are willing to die in the course of committing the attack, can such attacks really all be foiled. No.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

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rwetmore
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:15 pm

And if you can show me that that has been officially retracted, I'll happily change the title.

And I'm not being obtuse here. If it's genuinely wrong, I'll change it.
Last edited by rwetmore on Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

rwetmore
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Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2003 7:24 pm

Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:37 pm

Here is Trump's first press conference after the Paris attacks. He answers a ton of questions from the media on what he would specifically do to combat and defeat ISIS, and other related things:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBNKRfT6F84

I agree with everything he says in this press conference. He's looking more and more Presidential by the day and just thrives in these press conferences.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Fri Nov 20, 2015 3:31 am

rwetmore wrote:Where has it been officially established that none of the attackers appear to have entered Europe via the Syrian migration crisis? Doesn't it still appear that one of them did? Wasn't there a passport linked to one of them that entered in Greece? Whose fingerprints match those on the passport, or has this all been officially retracted now? If it has, I'll change the title.
As I've read the newspapers, the name in that passport is of a soldier in Bashar Al-Assad's army killed in combat some time ago. It is therefore not officially established that the person using that name, fingerprints or no, arrived in Greece from Syria among the hundreds of thousands of refugees. He may have arrived in Greece from Paris or Brussels for the purpose of getting a false passport. So far, it isn't known who and what he actually was, and how he wound up in Paris as one of the terrorists.

However, it has been officially established that all the other terrorists in the attack, and the man killed Wednesday who organized the attack, were citizens of France and Belgium. At least some of them are reported to have been born and raised there; possibly all of them were. An unknown number of them, including their leader, were radicalized and went from Europe to Syria to fight for ISIS, then returned home.

So your thread title should still be changed. It speaks of "Syrian migrants" in the plural when at most one of them may possibly be that, and says in effect that all the terrorists were Syrian migrants. That is not true. If you didn't know it's not true, if you've been ignoring all the news stories posted in this thread, you do now, and honesty requires you to change the thread title.

You go on to say, "one would have to be blind and foolish beyond belief to not the see the golden opportunity ISIS has to use the migrant crisis to further infiltrate the West with their members in significant numbers." This is completely irrelevant the title of the thread, which claims they already have. What the terrorist attacks in Paris do show, with no need for speculation, is that ISIS has already infiltrated the West with thousands of Europeans who were not born in Syria or Iraq but who went there, joined ISIS, then returned home. This is the real threat, and it's extraordinary that (for example) France's homeland security organizations failed repeatedly to surveil and control this menace within their own population.

Our own Department of Homeland Security has done much better. David Bier, an expert, writes in the Huffington Post, "Despite millions of refugees having been admitted since the U.S. refugee resettlement program began in its current form in 1980 -- including hundreds of thousands from the Middle East -- not a single refugee has committed an act of terrorism in the United States."

There's a reason for this. "For terrorists, the U.S. refugee process is the worst possible avenue in which to travel to the United States. The background checks involved are the most rigorous and the most extensive of those undertaken on foreign nationals coming here. This is likely why every 9/11 hijacker and all other foreign persons who've committed acts of terrorism were non-refugees -- they were mainly student or tourist visa holders."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-bie ... 84016.html

Read the Huffington Post article for a description of how the vetting is done and how long it takes. Obviously our standards are not going to be relaxed as they are applied to refugees from the Syrian wars.

(The Boston Marathon bombers weren't refugees but the sons of an immigrant from Kirgistan who obtained political asylum. The standards applied to asylum-seekers are quite different; for one thing, they can remain in the country which they have petitioned for asylum until their case is decided.)

A few among the hordes of unfortunate refugees streaming into Europe may indeed be wolves in sheeps' clothing. Nobody can say for sure one way or the other. The sheer number of refugees, for which Turkey and Greece were not and couldn't have been prepared, provides an opportunity. We have no solid evidence that it has actually happened - not yet. And if it does happen there, that doesn't mean it can happen here.

You ask, "Am I in the twilight zone here...is this real or am I dreaming?" It's certainly not real - that is, there's no solid evidence that it has happened even once, let alone on the scale that you fear. It's certainly a possibility, in countries which do not adequately segregate refugees from the general population, as for example in refugee camps, until they have been thoroughly vetted, as is the normal procedure. But instead of being frightened by what hasn't happened, I suggest you think about what has happened - the reality of home-grown terrorists, citizens who have turned against their home countries and ways of life and want to destroy them. That's evidently what just happened in Paris, and except for the 9/11 attack, which was organized and carried out by foreigners, it's the enemy within that has been killing Americans and from whom we have the most to fear.

Of course I know it's futile to reason with you. Never have you been willing to admit that you're wrong or that you might be. But one must try.
Last edited by John F on Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Fri Nov 20, 2015 7:39 am

John F wrote:You ask, "Am I in the twilight zone here...is this real or am I dreaming?" It's certainly not real - that is, there's no solid evidence that it has happened even once, let alone on the scale that you fear. It's certainly a possibility, in countries which do not adequately segregate refugees from the general population, as for example in refugee camps, until they have been thoroughly vetted, as is the normal procedure.
How can they possibly be vetted? I posted a link of quotes from the FBI director himself saying and warning that the refugees cannot be adequately vetted and if there are ISIS members among them we have no way of knowing. You do understand that when asked, they are not going to say they are ISIS members, right?
John F wrote:But instead of being frightened by what hasn't happened, I suggest you think about what has happened - the reality of home-grown terrorists, citizens who have turned against their home countries and ways of life and want to destroy them. That's evidently what just happened in Paris, and except for the 9/11 attack, which was organized and carried out by foreigners, it's the enemy within that has been killing Americans and from whom we have the most to fear.
Explain to me what tactical reason ISIS would have to not try to use the Syrian migrant crisis to further infiltrate the West in significantly more numbers? If it's not a golden, once in lifetime or greater, opportunity, for them please explain. What advantage do they gain by not doing it?
John F wrote:Of course I know it's futile to reason with you. Never have you been willing to admit that you're wrong or that you might be. But one must try.
Oh, I think you're being unfair. I can and have admitted I was wrong. I will change the thread title.
Last edited by rwetmore on Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

rwetmore
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Re: One of the PARIS TERRORISTS may have been a Syrian Migra

Post by rwetmore » Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:02 am

And if you think they can be adequately vetted, explain specifically how we can know if they are ISIS members and why the FBI director is wrong? Also, explain why ISIS wouldn't specifically send through those who couldn't be identified or would be the most difficult to identify.

Mind you, I think the overwhelming majority, i.e. like 99% or more, are not ISIS.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

rwetmore
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:16 am

John F wrote:If you haven't noticed, rwetmore, Ameican combat forces have been involved in Syria for quite a while, chiefly in the air. It began with support for the rebels against the murderous dictatorial regime of Bashar Al-Assad, and replacing that regime with one that's legitimate remains a chief American war aim. Later, when ISIS entered the conflict against both Al-Assad and the rebels against him, the U.S. began a bombing campaign against ISIS, and has continued it for nearly a year with more than 8,000 strikes in Syria and Iraq, while also continuing to provide aid to the rebels. Defeating ISIS, then, is our second war aim, and the administration believes it can't be achieved until Al-Assad has been removed, our first war aim. Some now say it's time to set aside one of those and focus exclusively on the other, and maybe so; see my next post below. But it's not true that we, or specifically President Obama as you say, haven't been "doing much" to fight "the enemy." To the contrary, we've been fighting two enemies.

ISIS has been losing ground recently,
In what way have they lost ground recently? By anything Obama has done? They just committed an attack in Paris and shot down a Russian plane a few weeks earlier. And who knows what they have coming in the near future. They don't look weakened to me in the slightest and seem to have reached a motivational high point and are more emboldened than ever.

Obama's 'pin pr*ck' air attacks haven't been very effective. I can appreciate his desire for no civilian casualties in these attacks, but the enemy just concentrates all it's resources in areas with a lot of civilians. So we never really do much damage to their resources and infrastructure.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

lennygoran
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Re: One of the PARIS TERRORISTS may have been a Syrian Migra

Post by lennygoran » Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:58 am

rwetmore wrote:
Mind you, I think the overwhelming majority, i.e. like 99% or more, are not ISIS.
Glad you finally changed the thread title-Obama has for the most part kept our soldiers boots off the ground-he recognizes what the pitfalls are we could get tied down in-too bad Bush the son didn't get it right like his father had after Operation Desert Storm. Regards, Len

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Re: One of the PARIS TERRORISTS may have been a Syrian Migra

Post by John F » Fri Nov 20, 2015 9:14 am

Thanks, rwetmore.

More about the home-grown terror threat here in America. It's a very long article and worth reading, but here are some highlights.

U.S. Investigators Struggle to Track Homegrown ISIS Suspects
By MICHAEL S. SCHMIDT, ERIC SCHMITT and MATT APUZZO
NOV. 19, 2015

WASHINGTON — At least three dozen people in the United States suspected of ties to the Islamic State were under heavy electronic or physical surveillance even before the Paris attacks, senior American officials say. But unlike the attackers in France, the officials say, the majority of those under investigation here never traveled to Syria to fight alongside the Islamic State or receive training from it.

In many ways, the officials say, that makes the American investigations even harder. Those under investigation typically have little terrorism expertise or support from a cell, which makes thwarting an Islamic State-inspired attack in the United States less like stopping a traditional terrorist plot and more like trying to prevent a school shooting.

Stopping a potential attack has taken on new urgency after Paris, which served as a reminder that even people who have already caught the eye of intelligence services can spring attacks on short notice. Although at this point American officials say there is no credible threat from the Islamic State inside the United States, they worry that Paris could provide the spark to inspire angry, troubled people to finally do something violent.

This year, American counterterrorism officials began focusing their resources on these Americans — known as homegrown violent extremists — after the Islamic State altered its tactics. After months of trying to persuade Americans to join it in Syria and Iraq, the Islamic State, also known as ISIS or ISIL, began using social media to urge its sympathizers in the United States to stay put and plot violence here. “They’re targeting the school-shooter types, the mentally ill, people with dysfunctional families and those struggling to cope with different issues,” said one senior law enforcement official on the condition of anonymity because he was not allowed to talk to reporters. “We have been pretty successful in disrupting these cases because they are not very sophisticated or smart.”

Despite the Islamic State’s urging of its followers to stay here, senior counterterrorism officials have so far identified roughly four dozen Americans who have evaded the authorities and traveled to Syria to join the Islamic State since the conflict began there in 2011, about twice the number that officials have said previously. Some are known to have died on the battlefield. A small number have returned to the United States but lost interest in the cause, the officials say...

For F.B.I. agents, watching an Islamic State suspect in the United States is a study in anxiety. Being an Islamic State sympathizer is not against the law. Neither is expressing hatred for the United States on Twitter. Buying guns is also legal, and investigators have watched nervously as terrorism suspects passed background checks and purchased guns more than 2,000 times in the past decade, according to government data.

The threat from the Islamic State has put a unique demand on American counterterrorism officials. Nobody expects the F.B.I. to discover the angry, violence-obsessed young man and arrest him before he shoots his classmates. But the same person, inspired by the Islamic State, is a priority. Missing him is considered an intelligence failure. So agents watch and wait, looking for some sign that yesterday’s angry man with a gun is about to become today’s terrorist. That is why investigators have moved to arrest people early, well before a plot is fully realized, and why agents often use undercover stings: They generate controversy but give the F.B.I. a measure of control.

The F.B.I. does not have explicit requirements on who should be monitored because of suspected ties to the Islamic State. But the bureau — whose agents constantly monitor chat rooms, the Islamic State’s Twitter accounts and other online traffic — focuses on people who have tried to directly contact the Islamic State through social media or have said they want to travel to Syria to join the group. The bureau also relies on information from relatives, friends, teachers, clergy members or others in the community about people suspected of ties to the Islamic State.

Attacks can come suddenly. In May, a young man in Syria put an ominous warning on Twitter: “The knives have been sharpened, soon we will come to your streets with death and slaughter!” Hours later, two Islamic State supporters opened fire outside a community center in the Dallas suburb of Garland, Tex. Both were killed by officers. After the attack, the Islamic State declared them “soldiers of the caliphate.” It was the first time that the terrorist group had claimed responsibility for an operation carried out on American soil.

As the Islamic State has changed its approach to encourage followers here, the authorities have detected a trend that they believe shows the impact of the group’s new message: There has been a significant drop in the number of Americans trying to travel to Syria and Iraq to join the group. Counterterrorism officials say that since July an average of two Americans a month have tried to travel or successfully traveled to Islamic State territory, compared with nine a month over the previous year...

It is not possible for the F.B.I. to conduct round-the-clock surveillance on all its Islamic State suspects since one day of surveillance on a single target might involve 30 agents and analysts or more. If the F.B.I. has to expand that surveillance to even a few dozen targets, officials say, the staffing requirements become overwhelming. This spring, the number of people under investigation for ties to the Islamic State was so high that surveillance agents had to be taken away from criminal investigations. Michael B. Steinbach, the F.B.I.’s assistant director for counterterrorism, said that this summer “the pace of investigations rapidly increased.”

The attacks in Paris on Friday were carried out by a team of terrorists that included at least five who investigators believe traveled to join the Islamic State. That type of plot was a major concern to American counterterrorism officials when the Islamic State rose to power in 2014 and dozens of its American supporters headed to Syria and Iraq. To more closely monitor them, the F.B.I. and the Department of Homeland Security used sophisticated algorithms to track Americans’ travel to the Middle East, and the State Department put pressure on Turkey to close its porous border with Syria...

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/20/us/us ... pects.html
John Francis

rwetmore
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Re: One of the PARIS TERRORISTS may have been a Syrian Migra

Post by rwetmore » Fri Nov 20, 2015 11:02 am

lennygoran wrote:
rwetmore wrote:
Mind you, I think the overwhelming majority, i.e. like 99% or more, are not ISIS.
Glad you finally changed the thread title-Obama has for the most part kept our soldiers boots off the ground-he recognizes what the pitfalls are we could get tied down in-too bad Bush the son didn't get it right like his father had after Operation Desert Storm. Regards, Len
He has largely kept troops off the ground, but whatever he's doing it's not working and/or isn't sufficient. We may ultimately have no choice but to send in ground troops, hopefully a true coalition of troops from many countries, though I suppose it's possible it might be avoidable through very aggressive bombing.

Here is a salient piece on this:

Obama’s phony war
by Charles Krauthammer

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... story.html
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

rwetmore
Posts: 3042
Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2003 7:24 pm

Re: One of the PARIS TERRORISTS may have been a Syrian Migra

Post by rwetmore » Fri Nov 20, 2015 1:22 pm

Here is another salient piece:

Paris massacre ringleader used migrant crisis to get into France, PM says

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/11/20 ... tcmp=hpbt1
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

Auntie Lynn
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Re: One of the PARIS TERRORISTS may have been a Syrian Migra

Post by Auntie Lynn » Fri Nov 20, 2015 2:22 pm

Wonder what part of 289--137 Old Mom Jeans Monkey doesn't understand...??

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Re: One of the PARIS TERRORISTS may have been a Syrian Migra

Post by Chalkperson » Fri Nov 20, 2015 3:28 pm

rwetmore wrote:
lennygoran wrote:
rwetmore wrote:
Mind you, I think the overwhelming majority, i.e. like 99% or more, are not ISIS.
Glad you finally changed the thread title-Obama has for the most part kept our soldiers boots off the ground-he recognizes what the pitfalls are we could get tied down in-too bad Bush the son didn't get it right like his father had after Operation Desert Storm. Regards, Len
He has largely kept troops off the ground, but whatever he's doing it's not working and/or isn't sufficient. We may ultimately have no choice but to send in ground troops, hopefully a true coalition of troops from many countries, though I suppose it's possible it might be avoidable through very aggressive bombing.

Here is a salient piece on this:

Obama’s phony war
by Charles Krauthammer

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... story.html
If troops were sent in, 75% would probably be Americans, just like always.

Even though there are war-gamed scenarios already worked out, the time it takes for NATO to set up a headquarters, pick a leader (probably US) and then for a coalition to decide on a plan is not a quick process.

You seem to expect this to be instant, it will take weeks, if not months, to get this up and rolling and the real fight with ISIS under way.

There are also complex legal issues to be worked out.

And, Putin and the Russians.

Read Jim Stavridis for suggestions of how this all works, he's appearing on TV and in magazines quite a bit right now.

He's a Twitter buddy of mine, we chatted about him showing Dr Strangelove to his Officers a few years ago. A forward thinking individual who is very open to input and ideas.

Then, I saw him on TV, he was in fact Admiral James Stavridis, the head of NATO and who oversaw the Libyan operation.

Social Media really does bring people together, he knew my friend Col. Bob who worked for General Petraeus in Iraq and Afghanistan, he had just visited their headquarters, Bob was Petraeus's Chief Strategist. They are both very interesting and intelligent men.

Petraeus is a little like Bruce Springsteen, they are both called simply, The Boss.

PS, thanks for changing the title, i'm sure you will be amending it further when the last terrorist is discovered to be a European National.

Being Nationals they can freely move on real passports, its not as easy when you sneak thru with the migrants.

There is no shortage of Terrorists already in Europe, yet again you over-react and assume that these ISIS infiltrators are suicide bombers, they are more likely sympathizers who spread propaganda and look for supporters.

ISIS are the ones who say they sent 3,000 people in with the Migrants, because they know that people like the GOP will believe them, and stop the migrants coming here.

705,000 migrants have been admitted since 9/11 and not one has been suspected of, or prosecuted for, Terrorist activities.

In my mind, you are very wrong to insist on spreading false information without retracting anything when the facts are known. Despite our most informed and eloquent members explaining things to you.

Admitting when you are wrong in this thread would be good for the Site.

For example, nothing to do with your claim in the Thread title of course.

There are now doubts being cast in French Media about the Female Suicide Bomber who died the other night, they think it may have been a man.

It's called the Fog of War, the Russians are dropping unguided bombs thru the clouds in Syria indiscriminately killing civilians, but the French have killed very few civilians in Raqqa.

You, Randall, are permanently in the fog.
Sent via Twitter by @chalkperson

Chalkperson
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Chalkperson » Fri Nov 20, 2015 3:37 pm

rwetmore wrote:Here is Trump's first press conference after the Paris attacks. He answers a ton of questions from the media on what he would specifically do to combat and defeat ISIS, and other related things:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBNKRfT6F84

I agree with everything he says in this press conference. He's looking more and more Presidential by the day and just thrives in these press conferences.
Oh boy, you really do want a complete and utter idiot in the White House again, at least Bush the Junior had been a Governor, all Trump knows about is building garish, ugly buildings, and golf courses for the rich.

As I said, you live in the fog Randall, lets hope enough American's don't, so we get an actual politician to run this country, not a blow hard, blow dried, buffoon.
Sent via Twitter by @chalkperson

rwetmore
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Fri Nov 20, 2015 4:54 pm

Chalkperson wrote:
rwetmore wrote:Here is Trump's first press conference after the Paris attacks. He answers a ton of questions from the media on what he would specifically do to combat and defeat ISIS, and other related things:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBNKRfT6F84

I agree with everything he says in this press conference. He's looking more and more Presidential by the day and just thrives in these press conferences.
Oh boy, you really do want a complete and utter idiot in the White House again, at least Bush the Junior had been a Governor, all Trump knows about is building garish, ugly buildings, and golf courses for the rich.

As I said, you live in the fog Randall, lets hope enough American's don't, so we get an actual politician to run this country, not a blow hard, blow dried, buffoon.
There is no substance in this reply of yours.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

lennygoran
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Re: One of the PARIS TERRORISTS may have been a Syrian Migra

Post by lennygoran » Fri Nov 20, 2015 4:59 pm

Auntie Lynn wrote:Wonder what part of 289--137 Old Mom Jeans Monkey doesn't understand...??
Added to resume-another insulting despicable comment--maybe you need a stronger dose of the root canal medication from that dentist of yours. Regards, Len :evil:

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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by Chalkperson » Sat Nov 21, 2015 12:34 am

rwetmore wrote:
Chalkperson wrote:
rwetmore wrote:Here is Trump's first press conference after the Paris attacks. He answers a ton of questions from the media on what he would specifically do to combat and defeat ISIS, and other related things:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBNKRfT6F84

I agree with everything he says in this press conference. He's looking more and more Presidential by the day and just thrives in these press conferences.
Oh boy, you really do want a complete and utter idiot in the White House again, at least Bush the Junior had been a Governor, all Trump knows about is building garish, ugly buildings, and golf courses for the rich.

As I said, you live in the fog Randall, lets hope enough American's don't, so we get an actual politician to run this country, not a blow hard, blow dried, buffoon.
There is no substance in this reply of yours.
Sure there is, if Trump really were elected America then World Leaders would be lining up to not meet with him, the US would be considered an unsafe power, simply because you can't put an idiot like Trump in the White House and not get deservedly ridiculed for four long years.

You don't like Trump's comments, you like those of his speechwriters and advisors.

And we now have an presidential candidate worthy of conversing with that other buffoon, the one from North Korea.
Sent via Twitter by @chalkperson

John F
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by John F » Sat Nov 21, 2015 2:52 am

rwetmore wrote:Here is Trump's first press conference after the Paris attacks. He answers a ton of questions from the media on what he would specifically do to combat and defeat ISIS, and other related things:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBNKRfT6F84

I agree with everything he says in this press conference. He's looking more and more Presidential by the day and just thrives in these press conferences.
First, Trump claims that if the US and/or its allies had "taken" Iraq's oil after defeating the Saddam Hussein regime, "We wouldn't have ISIS right now." Bull. The Middle East isn't as simple as Trump's simple mind.

Trump: "If you were a Muslim from Syria, you could get into this country - one of the easier places to come in." Bull. You and I know this isn't true, because we've read the Huffington Post article about how refugees from anywhere are vetted before they're allowed to come here, a process that can take 2-3 years each.

Trump: "If you were a Christian from Syria, it was almost impossible to get in, and yet the Christians were having their heads cut off." This has to be bull, that the United States has discriminated among refugees from Syria according to their religion, and against Christians in favor of Muslims. Trump just says it, he doesn't back it up.

Trump: "In 2000 I wrote a book, I said 'Osama bin Laden, you better take him out, he's a bad guy.' That was before the World Trade Center came down." So what? In 1998, bin Laden issued a fatwa urging Muslims to attack the U.S.; President Clinton's Department of Justice obtained an indictment in absentia against bin Laden; and Clinton ordered a cruise missile attack against bin Laden's camp in Afghanistan, intending to kill him. That's two years before Trump wrote his book.

Trump: "I think Obama wants 250,000 of the migrants, I think he wants them to come in." Bull. Where does Trump get this stuff? He says "A pretty good source" but says nothing about the alleged source or why it deserves belief.

Trump: "In my book I predicted terrorism, which some say was an even better prediction than Osama bin Laden." Bull. You can't "predict" what's already happened. The first attack on the World Trade Center was in 1993, by Ramzi Yousef and his followers who had trained with bin Laden and were financed by Al Qaeda. That's seven years before Trump wrote his book. Three of the conspirators were arrested and convicted in 1996.

Thus Donald Trump, a legend in his own mind. This is within just the first five minutes of the press conference. The "reporters," if that's what they were, fed him nothing but softballs and asked no follow-up questions; Trump was never pressed to provide factual backup for his claims.

At that point I stopped listening; I have a very limited tolerance for baloney. But if you can quote anything Trump said during the remaining 15 minutes, anything at all, that you can show for a fact to be true, and that's important enough to make you think him "presidential," I'll bet I can show you that it too is bull.
John Francis

rwetmore
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Re: PARIS TERRORISTS were Syrian Migrants...

Post by rwetmore » Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:06 am

John F wrote:
rwetmore wrote:Here is Trump's first press conference after the Paris attacks. He answers a ton of questions from the media on what he would specifically do to combat and defeat ISIS, and other related things:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBNKRfT6F84

I agree with everything he says in this press conference. He's looking more and more Presidential by the day and just thrives in these press conferences.
First, Trump claims that if the US and/or its allies had "taken" Iraq's oil after defeating the Saddam Hussein regime, "We wouldn't have ISIS right now." Bull. The Middle East isn't as simple as Trump's simple mind.

Trump: "If you were a Muslim from Syria, you could get into this country - one of the easier places to come in." Bull. You and I know this isn't true, because we've read the Huffington Post article about how refugees from anywhere are vetted before they're allowed to come here, a process that can take 2-3 years each.

Trump: "If you were a Christian from Syria, it was almost impossible to get in, and yet the Christians were having their heads cut off." This has to be bull, that the United States has discriminated among refugees from Syria according to their religion, and against Christians in favor of Muslims. Trump just says it, he doesn't back it up.

Trump: "In 2000 I wrote a book, I said 'Osama bin Laden, you better take him out, he's a bad guy.' That was before the World Trade Center came down." So what? In 1998, bin Laden issued a fatwa urging Muslims to attack the U.S.; President Clinton's Department of Justice obtained an indictment in absentia against bin Laden; and Clinton ordered a cruise missile attack against bin Laden's camp in Afghanistan, intending to kill him. That's two years before Trump wrote his book.

Trump: "I think Obama wants 250,000 of the migrants, I think he wants them to come in." Bull. Where does Trump get this stuff? He says "A pretty good source" but says nothing about the alleged source or why it deserves belief.

Trump: "In my book I predicted terrorism, which some say was an even better prediction than Osama bin Laden." Bull. You can't "predict" what's already happened. The first attack on the World Trade Center was in 1993, by Ramzi Yousef and his followers who had trained with bin Laden and were financed by Al Qaeda. That's seven years before Trump wrote his book. Three of the conspirators were arrested and convicted in 1996.

Thus Donald Trump, a legend in his own mind. This is within just the first five minutes of the press conference. The "reporters," if that's what they were, fed him nothing but softballs and asked no follow-up questions; Trump was never pressed to provide factual backup for his claims.

At that point I stopped listening; I have a very limited tolerance for baloney. But if you can quote anything Trump said during the remaining 15 minutes, anything at all, that you can show for a fact to be true, and that's important enough to make you think him "presidential," I'll bet I can show you that it too is bull.
I agree his predictions aren't that spectacular or genius, but they were accurate. I also haven't read the books so I'm not sure about all the details of his predictions. You fail to mention also that Clinton turned down a chance to get Bin Laden, though I forget what year that was. The rest you're just proclaiming to be 'bull' without really any support. Moreover, the meat of what he says is after the first five minutes where he talks about what he would do to combat ISIS.
"Most human beings have an almost infinite capacity for taking things for granted. That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."
- Aldous Huxley

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing has happened."
-Winston Churchill

“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one!”
–Charles Mackay

"It doesn't matter how smart you are - if you don't stop and think."
-Thomas Sowell

"It's one of the functions of the mainstream news media to fact-check political speech and where there are lies, to reveal them to the voters."
-John F. (of CMG)

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