The Triduum--ugh

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jbuck919
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The Triduum--ugh

Post by jbuck919 » Sat Mar 31, 2018 11:22 am

For those who do not know "Triduum" refers to the three days prior to Easter morning--Maundy Thursday, Good Friday, and the Easter Vigil. I survived the first two well enough, but this year our Anglo-Catholic rector decided for the first time to program a complete Easter Vigil the night before Easter, meaning that I have to be there for a service starting at 8:00 and lasting probably 2-1/2 hours.

I don't actually have that much to play, and nothing extra from Sunday morning, but it will still be more grueling than "midnight Mass" at Christmas, where I have to play a great deal. Aside from being very long, it contains everything except the kitchen sink. Wait a minute. If the baptismal font counts, it contains that too. It is, I admit, the central service of the church year, the real first Mass of easter, and very beautiful if done properly, which I have only seen once (at St. Paul's Outside the Walls in Rome), and then with reservations. One "highlight" is an extended preface known as the Exsultet from its first word in Latin. I have never heard it sung right by anyone but me singing it to myself for the heck of it. It used to be sung by a deacon, or a priest acting as a deacon, but in recent years the rubric has changed to allow a layman to sing it. I was going to volunteer, because I can just toss it off and not have to repress about seven dozen winches at someone else's performance, but it's a good thing I never got the words out of my mouth, because our young rector said "I've been practicing." The only thing I could think of was a Bar Mitzvah when the boy sings the Kaddish and if he makes a mistake, the cantor and both men in the synagogue's paid quartet (always fine singers all) chime right in to get him back on track. I don't think Tom would appreciated it if I did that.


There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

jserraglio
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jserraglio » Sat Mar 31, 2018 3:36 pm

Beautiful chant, thanks, sounds a bit strange in English. Easter Triduum inspired Dante's great poem: never made that obvious connection before reading this.

Belle
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by Belle » Sat Mar 31, 2018 9:56 pm

I couldn't see or hear any link from Jbuck's posting!! Loved the joke about the kitchen sink!!

This morning we've just returned from Christ Church Cathedral (Anglican) for the 'orchestral mass' and Eucharist. Orchestra, large pipe organ and choir in superb form (only it was often hard to hear the small orchestra because it was overwhelmed by the organ). I hadn't been to an Anglican service before and I was struck by how similar it is to the Catholic mass. My husband observed that as we walked away; he asked what I thought the differences were and I replied, "the Catholics have more to say during the mass". That and no prayers to Mary or references to the Pope (of course!). It's pleasing to notice much of the Catholic-style iconography and 'relics' missing from the cathedral as well. These were always the butt of jokes when we were growing up!!

jbuck919
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jbuck919 » Sat Mar 31, 2018 10:36 pm

Belle wrote:
Sat Mar 31, 2018 9:56 pm
I couldn't see or hear any link from Jbuck's posting!! Loved the joke about the kitchen sink!!

This morning we've just returned from Christ Church Cathedral (Anglican) for the 'orchestral mass' and Eucharist. Orchestra, large pipe organ and choir in superb form (only it was often hard to hear the small orchestra because it was overwhelmed by the organ). I hadn't been to an Anglican service before and I was struck by how similar it is to the Catholic mass. My husband observed that as we walked away; he asked what I thought the differences were and I replied, "the Catholics have more to say during the mass". That and no prayers to Mary or references to the Pope (of course!). It's pleasing to notice much of the Catholic-style iconography and 'relics' missing from the cathedral as well. These were always the butt of jokes when we were growing up!!
As a matter of fact, my parish, which is Anglo-Catholic, has a lot of RC-style iconography and possesses a relic of the true cross. (These are of course all phony and no one claims otherwise, but having one around is kind of fun when your parish is called Church of the Holy Cross.) Also, it has the Walsingham shrine for the Episcopal/Anglican diocese of Albany (I'll let you look that up), so it actually has a Mary "station" complete with icon and at the end of every "Mass" they stop there and sing a hymn to Our Lady.

The essential differences between the two liturgies are at the same time more subtle, harder for modern people to discern, and more important. The original Anglican service in the Book of Common Prayer was mainly written by Thomas Cranmer, Archbishop of Canterbury under Henry VIII, who had strong Protestant leanings. For example, the RC church taught, and still teaches, that every Mass is a re-enactment of the sacrifice on Cavalry. It is an essential Protestant/Lutheran teaching that there was only one sacrifice on the cross, namely the original one. Therefore Cranmer put language in his version of the Eucharistic prayer (the prayer that surrounds the consecration of the bread and wine), which bears no resemblance to the Roman Canon then in use and was cut by Cranmer from the whole cloth, which makes it clear in a very exaggerated fashion that Jesus's giving of himself on the cross was a "full, perfect, and sufficient sacrifice." Such things were once considered important and heads rolled, people were hanged, and bodies were burned over these differences of theological opinion. In fact, Cranmer himself was burned at the stake as a heretic when Mary Tudor tried to re-establish Catholicism.

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

jserraglio
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jserraglio » Sun Apr 01, 2018 3:08 am


jserraglio
Posts: 4725
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jserraglio » Sun Apr 01, 2018 4:04 am


Belle
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by Belle » Sun Apr 01, 2018 4:25 pm

My son accompanied his estranged wife and the children to an 'evangelical' church service yesterday for Easter Sunday. We compared notes last night about the Anglican service we attended and the 'happy clappers'! He observed, "there's no altar, just a stage and some of their 'readings' of the biblical texts seemed all over the place". It seems his education in the Catholic system wasn't completely wasted!

Anyway, it's got me thinking about these newer forms of christianity particularly when my son said they were connected by internet to about a dozen other venues around Australia during the service. Electric guitars and 'an extremely slick' form of presentation were the order of the day. They ushers to show people to seats and were super organized.

What's going on with this? I have to admit that I'm extremely skeptical. There have always been 'disrupters' in christianity but I can't help feeling this is different.

jbuck919
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jbuck919 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 9:30 pm

The second rendering is the original Latin,and exceedingly beautifully done. I have heard at least one lousy performance in Latin performed by a deacon just because he was a deacon. (It is traditionally the duty of a deacon.) Any priest can serve as a deacon, but in this case I strongly suspect they found a very talented minister who was ordained to the level of deacon.

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

jserraglio
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jserraglio » Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:57 pm

The Latin cantor was Fr. Alejandro Tobón, OCD, a Columbian priest belonging to the order of Discalced Carmelites and who also happens to be a trained musician.

Having been floored by Padre Alejandro's inspired rendering of this transcendent masterpiece several times since Sunday, I believe that if I had to, I would keep only this one example to remind me how enchanting is Gregorian chant. I have read that the Paschal Proclamation was not composed until after the tenth century, yet somehow it resonates with the culture of the ancient Middle East and the evangelical spirit of early Christianity.

Belle
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by Belle » Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:26 am

It's jaw-droppingly beautiful and transcendent.

jbuck919
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jbuck919 » Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:43 am

jserraglio wrote:
Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:57 pm
The Latin cantor was Fr. Alejandro Tobón, OCD, a Columbian priest belonging to the order of Discalced Carmelites and who also happens to be a trained musician.
I think you mean Colombian. ;)

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

jserraglio
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Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 7:06 am
Location: Cleveland, Ohio

Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jserraglio » Tue Apr 03, 2018 2:48 pm

Fray Alejandro has made some commercial recordings.

jbuck919
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jbuck919 » Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:43 pm

Here is another impeccable performance, this one performed by a real deacon, whom I take to be an American of Asian extraction, at a nonpareil location. Though the pope himself is not much of a latinist (this "performance" notwithstanding), you never can tell where you'll find one . The chief latinist of the Vatican is or used to be an American. (So is/was the organist at St. Peter's.)

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

jserraglio
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jserraglio » Tue Apr 03, 2018 6:20 pm

jbuck919 wrote:
Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:43 pm
Here is another impeccable performance, this one performed by a real deacon
Bring it on, please.

jbuck919
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jbuck919 » Tue Apr 03, 2018 7:04 pm

Sorry.


There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

jserraglio
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Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 7:06 am
Location: Cleveland, Ohio

Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jserraglio » Wed Apr 04, 2018 3:15 am

Thanks.

I also watched another interesting one last Sunday - the Praeconium Paschale celebrated in the Ambrosian or Milanese rite. Beautifully sung and fascinating. I love the archaic sound of all these chants, especially when recited in the original Latin. I have to say, though, that Padre Alejandro's rendition, performed as it was with such conviction and sacerdotal authority, moved me the most.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9LUeuxQl9BA&t=158s


Belle
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by Belle » Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:34 am

This reminds me of being at Hochamt at Augustinerkirche, Wien. I'll be back early next year for more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=du1wTMh6Ts8

jbuck919
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Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by jbuck919 » Sun Apr 08, 2018 8:09 pm

Belle wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:34 am
This reminds me of being at Hochamt at Augustinerkirche, Wien. I'll be back early next year for more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=du1wTMh6Ts8
The Ambrosian chant is much older than the Gregorian and much more primitive. It is very ancient. I consider the far more sophisticated Gregorian to be one of the culminations of Western music, namely that of monody, and it is the foundation of polyphony, However, in this case I may just prefer the Ambrosian. The reason for this is that the standard setting of the Exsultet is rather late, almost neo-Gregorian. It's belatedness, one might almost say decadence in a certain artistic not-necessarily-pejorative sense, at least to me. It is very nice I'm sure, but there are earlier Gregorian versions. I've never heard one, but wish I had.

There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself.
-- Johann Sebastian Bach

Belle
Posts: 1302
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:45 am

Re: The Triduum--ugh

Post by Belle » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:16 pm

Can you please tell me:

1. How I can find out more about all this (not Wiki!), and

2. Whether these organists in the great cathedrals are invested in the rite of the church where they are working, or whether they are simply doing a job of work?

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