The Intellectual Dark Web

Discuss whatever you want here ... movies, books, recipes, politics, beer, wine, TV ... everything except classical music.

Moderators: Lance, Corlyss_D

Post Reply
Belle
Posts: 1184
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:45 am

The Intellectual Dark Web

Post by Belle » Tue May 08, 2018 5:45 pm

I've been following these people for quite a while now and thriving on the discussions and it's genuinely exciting to hear these conversations between sometimes quite disparate people; always civil and respectful. As I've said before, the internet is leaving the MSM for dead these days and it will continue its march apace, particularly with younger generations. I'm the only person in my age group that I am aware of who engages with the Intellectual Dark Web. And I've been reading books recommended by some of them; shortly to tackle Dostoyevski. By extension, I've been enjoying the discussions with Steven Pinker and others. The Weinstein brothers (no relation!) are phenomenally intelligent.

I find it hilariously ironic when the writer talks about the dangers of "audience capture". And its occasionally censorious tone needs to be seen for what it is - the very reason this group exists in the first place!! The distinguishing characteristic of the Dark Web is that people are able to argue their ideas in a frank and dignified way, often with somebody who has an opposing view. In the case of Dave Rubin, he will often play devil's advocate.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/08/opin ... k-web.html

There are two aspects of this which have impacted on my life; firstly, I've grown closer to my eldest son who thrives on these intellectual challenges and, secondly, I become easily bored with people who want to tell me about what they've seen or heard on the ABC. Lame.

lennygoran
Posts: 13714
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:28 pm
Location: new york city

Re: The Intellectual Dark Web

Post by lennygoran » Tue May 08, 2018 7:30 pm

Belle wrote:
Tue May 08, 2018 5:45 pm
I'm the only person in my age group that I am aware of who engages with the Intellectual Dark Web.
Belle it seems to me Trump's people are accusing the Mueller investigation of being part of that-they sure have that wrong. Regards, Len :(

Belle
Posts: 1184
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:45 am

Re: The Intellectual Dark Web

Post by Belle » Tue May 08, 2018 7:55 pm

lennygoran wrote:
Tue May 08, 2018 7:30 pm
Belle wrote:
Tue May 08, 2018 5:45 pm
I'm the only person in my age group that I am aware of who engages with the Intellectual Dark Web.
Belle it seems to me Trump's people are accusing the Mueller investigation of being part of that-they sure have that wrong. Regards, Len :(
Hi Len; I'm not interested in American politics as to parties etc. The Dark Web explores social issues, intellectual movements, ideas, dissidents, culture...the lot!!

Here's another site which tells more about the people on the "Dark Web"

http://intellectualdark.website/

Dave Rubin explains the paradigms:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5HN-KT9rj0

It's terribly exciting.

lennygoran
Posts: 13714
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:28 pm
Location: new york city

Re: The Intellectual Dark Web

Post by lennygoran » Wed May 09, 2018 7:31 am

Belle wrote:
Tue May 08, 2018 7:55 pm
Hi Len; I'm not interested in American politics as to parties etc. The Dark Web explores social issues, intellectual movements, ideas, dissidents, culture...the lot!!
Belle thanks-found info on wiki:

Themes

Support for freedom of speech[1][2][3][5][6]
Opposition to political correctness[1]
Opposition to third-wave feminism[1][2]
Opposition to censorship[2][6]
Opposition to identity politics[2][5][4]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_dark_web

Regards, Len

Belle
Posts: 1184
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:45 am

Re: The Intellectual Dark Web

Post by Belle » Wed May 09, 2018 4:59 pm

That and other things. Take care with Wiki; people put those entries in - and we don't know who they are - and they choose the label and description themselves. This is often very inaccurate.

It has really little to do with party politics (except insofar as some parties might adopt these) and the concerns these people raise are a part of the socio-cultural and intellectual landscape of the USA and also in Canada, UK and Australia. This is an excellent talk about liberty and freedom of speech from an extremely clever and intelligent man who comes from an academic institution: like Professor Jordan Peterson he rejects their narratives. Highly recommended:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bz0oxIZ3xIg

As I said before, the internet is powering ahead of the MSM and is changing the intellectual ccommunication and mainstream news and opinion landscape.

lennygoran
Posts: 13714
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:28 pm
Location: new york city

Re: The Intellectual Dark Web

Post by lennygoran » Thu May 10, 2018 5:58 am

Belle wrote:
Wed May 09, 2018 4:59 pm
Take care with Wiki; people put those entries in - and we don't know who they are - and they choose the label and description themselves. This is often very inaccurate.
Belle just wondering if you can spell out where the wiki article got it wrong--I'd love to know because I use wiki quite alot. I'll also point out even though I know you want to go beyond politics Trump talks about cultural things frequently-for example the standing for the national anthem, the media as fake news even threatening to restrict press credentials at his events, his comments on Charlottesville view:

""Well, I do think there's blame -- yes, I think there's blame on both sides. You look at -- you look at both sides. I think there's blame on both sides. And I have no doubt about it, and you don't have any doubt about it either. ... But you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides. "

He's way off here imo-there are no good Nazis. Regards, Len

Belle
Posts: 1184
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:45 am

Re: The Intellectual Dark Web

Post by Belle » Thu May 10, 2018 7:59 am

I don't care at all about Trump or what he says. I'm interested in ideas about culture, politics, philosophy, values, freedoms etc. These are the things the IDW's talk about. So it isn't just those things listed on Wiki; I don't know who wrote that but I can guarantee it wasn't one of the IDWers. They're concerned about freedom of speech, religious issues, responsibilities and values, "the gated institutional narrative" - the whole panoply of what it means to have a meaningful, free life and how that is expressed, challenged or repressed in the public space. It's an organic discussion which keeps growing. I'm loving it. These people are outside the mainstream and their views are all the richer for that.

Wiki is dead wrong about "Spiked Online", as is discussed in the link. Wiki calls them "libertarians" but, according to Bret Weinstein, "they bridled at that suggestion and told us to ignore Wiki". It's the issue of authorship and anybody can write what they like about some person or group and it largely goes unchallenged. Those things you listed - I don't know where you got them from but they paint with far too broad a brush with regard to the IDW. Eric Weinstein coined the term Intellectual Dark Web during a discussion (I actually watched) on "The Rubin Report" last year. He and his brother appeared together - both phenomenally intelligent.

The best thing you could do is look at some of the discussion from the IDWs and judge for yourself. Don't expect to hear anything - or very much - on Trump or anyone else in mainstream politics, except perhaps in reference to how groups of people think and behave and the role of the MSM. Here's just a small sample:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmXq97do-tQ

The usual gambit of name-calling has been applied to Dr. Peterson, who was recently called "Hitler" because of his views. Somebody said, "Oh yes, Hitler taught at Harvard; Hitler wrote books on religion and philosophy; Hitler had a PhD, a wife, children and grandchildren; Hitler wanted to help young people improve their lives"... It was a good argument but indicative of the level of public discourse that a profoundly gifted public intellectual can be compared to Hitler!! As was stated at the end of the NYT article I posted above - and indicative of a super reactionary mindset:

“Some say the I.D.W. is dangerous,” Ms. Heying said. “But the only way you can construe a group of intellectuals talking to each other as dangerous is if you are scared of what they might discover.”

lennygoran
Posts: 13714
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:28 pm
Location: new york city

Re: The Intellectual Dark Web

Post by lennygoran » Thu May 10, 2018 8:45 am

Belle thanks-maybe I'll get a chance to watch some of their clips but right now it's out to the garden-the weeds are growing! Regards, Len :(

Belle
Posts: 1184
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:45 am

Re: The Intellectual Dark Web

Post by Belle » Thu Jun 14, 2018 1:05 pm

Really interesting radio interview about the IDW, though the interviewer is something of a stooge unable to think outside the square:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0b60wnq

As Professor Niall Ferguson said recently, "the price for speaking out against 'woke progressives' is reputational destruction". There's a train coming....

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests